I can see what you're saying, I truly can. And I agree with you... up until you said SLEEPAWAY CAMP sucked.

The '80s were a great time in horror and the golden era of horror for my generation. Much like the Universal Monster films of the '30s & '40s or the Hammer films of the '60s & '70s were to the generations before us.

Saying that most of the horror films from the '80s were awful is pretty harsh. I see nothing wrong with most of these independent filmmakers wanting to pay "homage" to the '80s. Actually, I think it's a great thing. Adam Green's HATCHET is a straight-up "homage" to the "sucky" '80s and I think people will be quite surprised by what they see. And what do you think the awesome BEHIND THE MASK: THE RISE OF LESLIE VERNON was?

There is nothing new on the market that would make me want to bury the '80s in the past. What are my choices, SAW IV? I KNOW WHO KILLED ME? Please. All I ask in my horror films are three simple things; 1) Decent story, not great. 2) Likable characters. 3) Entertain me.

No disrespect, Mr. Kiernan, because I enjoy your blog posts and respect your opinions. You just struck a chord in me. I'm very protective of my '80s horror films, as I am with my Universal Monsters. Speaking of which, the Universal Monsters are being invaded with remakes, where do you stand on that?

P.S. I'm curious to know what you or anyone else thought about MADMAN, THE BURNING, and films of that nature?

most 80s horror movies are not bad, thats a pretty harsh statement. ok i will agree most were low budget, had bad acting, a bad story line, and were second rate. but with all that said look at todays horror. what are my choices to go see right now: 1408, hostel 2, saw 4, vacancy, hannibal rising, the hills have eyes 2, dead silence, let me give you a better term, nothing good.

who else agrees with me on this. id rather watch slumber party massacre 1, friday the 13th 5-8, jaws the revenge, alone in the dark, the prowler, halloween 3 season of the witch, and terror train for a whole week than what we have today, the 80s horror was superior. why dont people realize that.

instead people today will shell out 10 bucks to go see saw 4. they'll tell you over and over again they know and love horror but have never seen the howling, the fog, or night of the living dead. i keep trying to show people how better the classic and 70s/80s horror is to the junk we have today.

malice, i think the burning and madman are fine, better than hostel 2 and all this other new junk.

im not showing any disrespect matthew kiernan i like reading all the storys from all the editors here but i just dont get how you can say most of the 80s horror sucked and you would just throw it away for todays crap. what does everybody think about this topic.

Wow..pretty harsh words there about the 80's movies...I myself am a Halloween (Michael Meyers)phanatic...I disagree with your article..but appreciate your opinion..

i love 80's movies. c'mon, they were fun. you know the blob with kevin dillon was hilarious. killer klowns from outer space is excellent. i love movies like the shining, the excorcist, and tobe hooper's classic, the texas chainsaw massacre. in all honesty though, i would rather watch freddy's dead. the final nightmare than the ring 2 anyday. 80's movies are just fun to watch. i miss being 12 years old and going to the video store to see what cheesy, straight to vhs slaughter romp they had on the new release shelves. doesnt anyone else?

does anyone remember that creepy movie with wil wheaton from the 80's called the farm? his family is poisoned by the well water and turning all cannibal. i would love to see that one again. pumpkinhead, child's play, they live. the 80's rules. i also love that ,ovie "the hidden" with ed'o ross and kyle mcclacklan.

I really like some of the films you all have mentioned, especially "The Prowler" and "Killer Klowns from Outer Space". And I thought I was the only one who enjoyed "Freddy's Dead: The Final Nightmare" (although that was released in 1991), but I guess that makes two fans now. Haha!

Sure, maybe the storylines for most of the '80s horror films weren't all that great, but at least they did do something that today's films cannot do... and that's entertain you for 90 minutes. I hardly remember leaving the theater or returning a VHS to the video store and saying "Boy! That sure was a huge waste of time and money". Now days I don't even bother renting anything and it takes a great marketing blitz to get me out to the theater. And why is it that the good stuff today goes direct-to-DVD or has a very limited theatrical release? Such as "Feast", "Behind the Mask: The Rise of Leslie Vernon", and even Edgar Wright's non-genre (but still drenched in gore) "Hot Fuzz" or "Pan's Labyrinth"?

Forget about the '80s and focus on today? Go tell that to the Weinstein's. I mean, they throw a potentially great film into production and then when the film is in the can, they go and re-edit it to their liking (Cursed) or do a poor job of marketing a film and release it during Easter weekend (Grindhouse) and wonder why it bombed.

So, really the good films are there, it's the studios that are destroying them on the cutting room floor or the script is there and they choose to produce a film that is a sure flop instead. Good example? "MEG" vs. "Snakes on a Plane".

By the way, it did take a little thinking, but "Pet Sematary" was a true horror classic from 1989. But mentioning 1989 is a bit unfair, because we all know that was the beginning of the transition into the '90s when horror was pretty much dead, but was revived by "Scream". Which is also funny because that film borrowed a lot from the '80s films and was directed by a legendary '80s director in Wes Craven. Weird how the '80s influence for "Scream" brought horror back from the grave in the late '90s.

i look forward to rob zombie's halloween. he really came into his own with the devils rejects. that movie is just genious. pet sematary is a great flick from 1989. the reviews were terrible, but any king fan would dig it. i'll tell you another straight to dvd movie that is awesome. sephen king's desperation. that movie is just down right creepy. also love john carpenter's in the mouth of madness

I think these people are forgetting the part where you said just because we were ENTERTAINED by a movie, doesn't make it a good quality movie.

The only good remake of a horror movie I have EVER seen was the Dawn of The Dead remake. It wasn't a rip off of the original, but more of a revamping.

I completely agree that filmmakers have lost their minds thinking that gore and shaky camera movements make a movie scary...or even good.

I really enjoyed the Silent Hill movie for its pacing, camera work, fx, original dialogue, and character choices.

When you're paying "homage" to something you are capturing an essence of the original, not copying it. Rob Zombie's "The Devil's Rejects" was a great example of paying homage. However, The Hills Have Eyes and The Texas Chainsaw Massacre just felt like someone took the old movies and made them bloodier. Boo!!! That's just cheap and completely void of creativity.

You know I read every single comment on here and was laughing. The part where Scream brought horror back! I totally disagree with this. Scream was not scary...it is a date movie..high school stuff!

For me...less marketing makes me see the movie. I hate it when a trailer comes out and a lot is going on but yet when you see the movie the trailer was the movie.

I must comment on SILENT HILL! My boyfriend is really into the Silent hill story...i know a lot of the story from research as well and come to find out that Silent Hill sucked. So many things wrong with it. Why a slut girl? Is sex horror? NOT!

I hate the fact that a lot of movies has some dumb girl in it! I can't count how many times i have been disappointed in movies.

Rob Zombie..."Devils Rejects" sucked as well...Sex was the thyme...nothing else...so you see blood and blood dosent scare me! ROB Zombie needs to stick with his music and stay out of the movies. I was pretty upset about the Holloween remake and he was doing it. Leave the greats alone and think of your own ideas. Just because you have an upside down crucifix on your four head doesn't mean you are the master of Horror!

The original Fly scared me...creepy. The remake was good but the hole time watching it i was thinking i like the original better!

Too many movies are to typical and sick of it! The 80's did not suck! there is a lot more great in the 1980's than now! I can say the 1408 by Steven was great. I love every minute of it. Yes it scared me! That is horror!

vicky, you sound like a shitty movie critic. your very opinionated and downright rude. the devils rejects was awesome. the only positive thing that was in your long, drawn out, overcritical comment was that you liked the original fly? david cronenberg's the fly blew that movie into pieces. yes the original fly is good but not even half as intense at cronenberg's. i did love zack snyder's dawn of the dead but it wasnt as good as romero's. romero was making a point with his dead movies. snyder was just entertaining and grossing out his fans. i saw 2004's dawn of the dead in the theatre 3 times and i bought it the day it came out on dvd. its one of the best horror movies in a long time actually. zack has really shown his audience what he is capable of with 300 and i cant wait to see what he has in store for us next. vicky, i dont know why you are so negative. quit pretending like your roger ebert or leonard maltin and just watch the movie for what it is. movies are for entertainment.

one more thing vicky, i agree with what you said about scream. if you really watch scream for what it is, it is a comedy that pay homage to halloween, prom night, and all the good scary movies from the 80's. c'mon vic, it had david arquette and henry winkler in it for fucks sake. it wasnt eant to be as big as it got, and if you listen to the commentary track, wes craven says just that. i like scream but just for laughs. i dont like it no more than killer klowns from outer space.

what the hell is with the haim and feldman pic above? that pic is not from the lost boys. its from dream a little dream. what the hell!!

I never said "Scream" was a great flick. Like Vito said, it's good for laughs, but if you ask any horror critic, writer, director, fan or whatever, they'll tell you "Scream" helped bring the genre back to the big screen. You cannot deny that! And yes, it was a film directed at kids in their late teens to early twenties (back then), but that trend continues into today's society as well.

And yes, I did take notice where Mr. Kiernan said "Entertainment vs. Quality", but really, what's the difference? So, instead of having a good time watching the scares and blood flow, I'm supposed to learn something new and leave the theater thinking "Freudian" thoughts? I'm sorry, if I wanted that to happen I would pick up a book, not watch images flash before my eyes in a dark theater that reaks of butt and stale popcorn. It's much like going to the Go-Kart track really, I don't go there to learn how to fix cars or why oil spots make you slide, but rather to enjoy sliding on THE oil spots.

So, really, instead of "Entertainment vs. Quality" it should be about "Quality Entertainment". If you want to learn something new and be amazed by lame CGI then I suggest you go watch films like "Harry Potter", because if you think all these homages to the '80s is a bad thing, then you are in the wrong genre. Because we love our horror films, no matter what decade they came from. This whole arguement is petty and makes me question a few people's real loyalty to this genre and you know who you are.

Oh, and the comment about Rob Zombie sticking to music.. that's just ignorant. Sounds like someone is just mad that he is putting his own little touches on a film many consider to be a classic. As do I, but you are foregetting one major thing. John Carpenter did two remakes as well or did you forget that "The Thing" and "Village of the Damned" were remakes? Rob Zombie has just as much right to be making films as John Carpenter (who are actually good friends). If you want to get on anyone's case about the original Halloween, then go mouth off to the legendary Tom Savini, who thinks the film is awful and greatly overrated. Or as this article would say, Savini think's it "SUCKS".

I agree and disagree. While the 80s definitely had it's share of bad horror movies, I don't think I would say there were ten bad ones for every good one. Plus, I think that if I did have a good time watching New Year's Evil with my buddies that does make it a good movie for me -- maybe not a classic or something that I would recommend, but good for me.

Censorship of The Godfather?

I have the original on VHS tape and was quite surprised of the censorship/editing of Godfather 1 as it was aired at 8:00 pm EST on the Rogers Network in Toronto (Canada) .. could you please advise what the present censorship/editing policies are of your network. As a student of contemporary film literature I am confused on which presentation/version is authentic and which has been doctored to suit the expediency of your politics and politics. May I recommend a brief statement at the beginning of future broadcasts/airings where historic pieces are doctored to the effect ...

"Although this version of The Godfather may appear authentic. it has been edited and censored to comply with our political and cultural politics in existence on July 15, 2007. It should therefore not be considered as 100% authentic due to the dubbing of sound and doctoring of scenes from the original production whic was released by Paramount Pictures in 1972"

Personally, I resent your tinkering and distortion of history. It is a calculated and deliberate prevarication to serve your self interests.

i have one thing to say on this topic: you go malice! read his last post it should be useful to half of you.

Some excellent points here in the comment section of my misguided co-worker's post here.

He's forgotten Sturgeon's Law, of course which states that ninety percent of everything sucks.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sturgeon's_law

The picture is hilarious, though (whatever its origin).

Folks look back on the 70's now as the Silver Age of horror, and they may be right, but I think there are as many terrible movies from that glittery decade reflecting back at you from the kaleidescope of the disco ball.

I don't think anything can or should be pigeon-holed in something as restrictive as the decade it came out in. It should just be judged on whether it scared you or you had fun watching it, and there are plenty of movies from the 80's that did both. Many of you have cited them.

On the other points you guys are bringing up: I liked Scream, but dislike most of the poor imitators it wrought. Ten years of new movies that were what Scream was making fun of got un-ironically cranked out.

I think Rob Zombie is like a fan with a budget. His influences are the "right" ones, but he has yet to show me anything more than he's seen the same movies we have. I want his movie after Halloween to be a real movie and not just a love letter to the 70's.

I don't understand the Godfather comment, but good luck in your studies!

If you look at Rob Zombie's films-to-date, you'll notice that it kind of resembles John Carpenter's. Carpenter started out admiring and making a few homages to those '50s/'60s sci-fi films that he loved, made a classic horror film in "Halloween", and then made a classic remake in "The Thing" and went on to do the amazing "Escape From" films.

So, hopefully with "House of 1000 Corpses" and "The Devil's Rejects" out of the way as his homages, then make his re-imaging of "Halloween" a hit, maybe he'll move onto something that will be all his own.

I do admire Rob Zombie for one thing, he was approached to make Halloween 9, but told the Weinstein's that he refused to do it because? "I won't do Halloween 9 because you have f***** the series up". Which is true, the whole franchise was lost after "Halloween 5". And if you want to jump start a franchise again, the best way is to go back to the basics, the beginning.

Wait! Weren't we talking about the sucky '80s horror films? Which I guess Halloween does have roots in... And that person who made the comment about censoring the Godfather seems really angry. What's that all about?

i like you malice, your views on films are terrific. i can tell that you have the passion of a true film buff. i too am a film buff, and i give any director the chance to share their visions. sure there will probabaly never be another horror film nominated or winning the best picture award. the silence of the lambs will always be the one that broke the mold and was truly embraced by critics and the academy. i dont care how many times i watch it, when buffalo bill shuts the lights out, leaving clarice starling in the dark, scary basement, i still get white knuckles.

i watch any horror film that comes out just because i am a fan of gore and scares. i agree with escape from new york being a classic but escape from l.a. was a nightmare of epic preportions. it should have never have been made. alot of john carpenter's movies are excellent but he has his share of garbage as well. the prince of darkness, escape from l.a., village of the damned, and the hilariously stupid ghosts of mars. i love carpenter as a filmaker but he also is a hollywood whore. he loves the money.

zack snyder is the best new director there is right now in my opinion. he is young, smart, and extremely talented. 300 was so awesome i went to see it twice in the theatre, and i cany wait until july 29, so i can own it on dvd. what did you guys think of black xmas or turistas? i digged'em both. i also love slither, mainly because it was funny and scary.

it think i miss guided yall with my first post. i kind of made it sound like all new horror sucks and thats not what i meant, i will say 80s beats todays horror to death but that doesnt mean all new horror is bad,

from what i consider new horror (early 90s

to today) there was some good stuff but you know it wasnt 1980 where you got classics left and right. im not trying to sound too negative towards todays horror but i just think there is not much thats new, like what has been brought up so many times rob zombie's house of 1000 corpses. i like the paying homage to the classics too but i do want to see more new ideas and original movies than sequels/remakes.

i cant say scream is a good movie but it did kind of revive the horror genre.

and how come if i didnt have a good time watching a movie then that doesnt mean its good, isnt that what its all about.

and as far as halloween goes, i dont support a remake but i rather it be in zombie's hands than anybody else. it may turn out good though, remember john carpenter and david cronenberg did remakes too.

Hey guys,

First off, I'm tickled pink by the reaction. Many of you have expressed yourselves beautifully and your points are all well-taken (except for that whole "Godfather" thing - what's that about?). But my point still stands: Let's make new, original horror films that reflect our era. The original TEXAS CHAINSAW MASSACRE was all about doing something different and really scaring the hell out of people. I'd rather see that than another movie like MALEVOLENCE that simply wants to remind you what a great movie the original TEXAS CHAINSAW was, 'cause I've already seen it!

Like yesterday, when I saw the DEATH NOTE movies up here at Fantasia; one of the things I liked so much about them was that they weren't like a lot of other Asian horror movies and that the films were filled with some interesting social and political commentary. Doesn't make them great, but they're more interesting to watch than yet another movie about a haunted or possessed item of some sort. It's great when a movie can say something about the era you live in because it can help changed your way of thinking. Simply saying, "We're the 80s great?" isn't enough for me anymore.

Besides, I saw duds like 976-EVIL and THE HORROR SHOW in theaters back in the 80s and I'm never going to get that time back. And that pisses me off!

P.S. - Sorry, Malice, but PET SEMATARY is not a classic. I don't even think Stephen King likes it (but I could be wrong about that).

The one thing that I think keeps getting passed up in this debate is a subject that has been broached before on this blog, and that is the age at which you saw these films!

To me it sounds like, like me, you grew up in the late 70's and through the 80's and these films kind of shaped who you are and what your tastes are. There is no problem in that at all except, your too close to the source material and it holds a personal reflection for you. Instead of looking at it through the objective eye of a critic you simply remember your youth and the good times these films presented for you.

There are some films that I am totally in love with. Slaughter Hotel, this film is terrible to the critical eye, but the film buff in me loves Klaus Kinski and the color on the canvas of the film. I also dig the hell of out the nonsensical script and mucked up plot, but you get my drift right? I'm able to distinguish that the film sucks, but I love it for reasons that are only my own.

So there you go, I really beleive that the author of this original post dosen't think the 80's horror in general sucked, it's just that all of these filmmakers today that are trying to ride a bandwagon are forgetting that a lot of the 80's did suck, because for every 5 good ones there were at least 10 that didn't work but have something that works for each viewer individually. I think some of these guys, yeah you Adam Green, need to realize that it was more than skin and gore that made these films of the 80's what the are to the viewer. They were experiences, like your first time, it was an event, you were excited nervous and ready but you still trembled even though you were having a good time.

That's it, these films for you were like your first sexual encounter, clumsy, nervous, over anxious and come in gone (pun intended)in a matter of minutes but they have lasted in your memories as the pinnalce of greatness.

Take that to your blog writing school, I tied this whole thing up by relating your frist time with horror films!

I disagree with your opinion on '80's horror movies. They paved the way for the horrors of today! I personally loved the old horror movies. At least most of them made sense and could happen, the movies today with ghost, etc. are never really going to happen. So who would be into those type movies. Don't get me wrong I don't dislike the movies of today. But at least with Jason that could really happen, there could be a real killer out there like him hunting you in the woods. And as far as Sleepaway Camp, that movie has alot of fans just check out there web site. I respect your opinion, I just don't agree.

THE TEXAS CHAINSAW MASSACRE (the original one anyways) is great, I love it. But even that film stole a bit of influence from the past. Sure Tobe Hooper's bad shopping experience at Sears during the holiday season helped push him to write the script, but c'mon, Ed Gein is the true inspiration to that film. And MALEVOLENCE? Yeah, that was just a bad film overall. Half the time I couldn't even see what was going on. But the director Stevan Mena I feel has a lot of promise. Oh, and if you hated the first one, lookout, Part 2 is close to happening.

I mean, we could all sit here day-after-day and argue about getting some new, original horror films made, but really... Is anything original? Why has it come to this? And in this genre? These are horror films and they are meant to exploit. These films are made to entertain, not to make you jump out of your seat and say "Wow! I think I want to be a brain surgeon". You want that kind of reaction, then I suggest you go watch something like THE ENGLISH PATIENT or some other snoozer like it.

I respect your opinions, Mr. Kiernan, but shouldn't you be typing up something more along the lines of "Face It: Everything is an Homage"? Attacking a decade of horror films that is beloved by millions is walking a fine line. I don't know, maybe your recent trip to Fantasia has influenced you to mock a fan-base that is well established and very protective of their films.

You talk about all the new filmmakers that spend their time making "homages" to the '80s... which is really influence. And how does any film idea old or new come to be? That's right! Because someone was influenced by another film, that was made because it was influenced by a film before it or a book or an article. Perhaps even local folklore.

Maybe I'm the only person that this makes sense to, but it sure sounded good in my head. It's simple to me, homages are a good thing because it means someone saw a film as a kid and something lit up inside of them and inspired them to be a filmmaker. Now they are paying respect to those that made them what they are today. Kind of like how most of us want to grow up and be like our mothers or fathers.

Everything that might be considered original is really based on influence of some type... an homage! Maybe you don't see it scene after scene, but it's there in the depths of it's soul somewhere.

P.S. PET SEMATARY isn't a classic? Ouch! If King doesn't think it is... well then it's his own fault. Because he wrote the screenplay for it.

malice, i get what you mean. and you get the point im trying to get across. being inspired by an older film is great! im glad, go make a really good horror film with the same elements but all your own. thats what i like, but remakes and knock offs is what i hate to see, making a film inspired by another one means catching the essence of it, not a remake.

p.s. why isnt pet semetary considered a classic to you matthew kiernan. and 1989 was an unfair year to give and you know that was the worst year for horror out of the 80s.

I agree with Cella, the 1980’ paved the way for the 90’s and present.

You wouldn’t have The Saw’s, The Hostiles, Scream, etc without those classic campy horror flicks of the early 80’s.

Every generation has their own view of what was great because this is what they saw and appreciated as teenagers. Who is anyone to say that the science fiction of the 1950’s, and the Universal Monsters of the 1940’s were the worst or best?

Sure I was a pre-teen and a teenager in the 80’s and of course I loved all those slasher flicks no matter how repetitious and ridiculous they all became.

Everything comes to an end eventually. You can’t have men in ski masks slasing virgins forever, or Frankenstein running around an old castle. Things change specially in the horror genre.

This brings me back to how the 1980’s paved away for future horror classics.

I can list many great, fun very entertaining scary movies from this decade, along with crap, just as I can do for the 90’s and now.

So in the end please leave my generation alone.

Play fair please.

Thank you!