FIRST!

I think I'm the first this time! Yay!

I am really #1.

I'm #1

The clock went back a week ago Lily. it is 6:50 as I submit this

PLEASE stop showing your Junky Trailers @ the corner of my picture you ruin my pleasure of enjoying your Channell
Thankyou
Bob

I can't believe it's the last episode of the Season!

#6! Anonymous doesn't count!

Can't wait. Hope it's longer than the usual episode length.

I predict by series 6 Roger and Red will be together. He'll be divorced. She'll be widowed. - you read it here first :)

I was actually first, took one look at the empty site, and decided to do the gallant thing and allow others to go first. ;o)

Here's my prediction for the season finale:
Don and Betty will split . . . or will look as though they're going to split. She moves to Philly after he buys her the house there. I can't see Don hanging tough or licking his wounds for very long while he watches another man (or men) "cutting his lawn." After all, he's in love with her--all the other women have been dalliances (as Rachel Menken rightly put it). And she'll be living there on his nickel, so . . . . And then Don will spend season 4 winning her back. JJ will, alas, have a smaller, but still important, role in season 4, as we watch Don rebuild the relationship, while (parallel here) building his own (or the resurrected SC) adv. firm that brings back both Sal and Joan. Gosh!--this season has been so dark, I have to be optimistic. They've got to take us somewhere hopeful next season! I can't help but think that Anna will be involved in this rebuilding process in some way. Maybe there will be a stronger CA connection next season?

I've thought of other possiblities:
1. Don collapses from the shock of the breakup of his marriage and the demise of SC (he's not perfectly well--remember the warning at the doctor's office? he's collapsed before, like at the end of season 2, while in the company of the jet setters. well, they probably won't do that again, since they've already done it once.) And Betty sticks it out to nurse him back to health.
2. Betty is so distraught that she takes an overdose of sleeping pills (perhaps unintentionally). This is a huge life-altering wake-up call for Don. It reminds him of his brother and "the silo," the scene of Archie's death, for which he is responsible.

Finally, do you remember the boy playing "In the Hall of the Mountain King" at his piano lesson at Anna's house? How ominous that was, when you consider it comes from Grieg's incidental music for Ibsen's reworking of the fairy tale on Peer Gynt (obviously a Don Draper character). Someone, somewhere has surely commented on this before. I won't bore you with all of the details. You can read it in any synopsis on the web (wikipedia, for example).

In short, there are Many (MANY) connections to our story. In this case, Betty would be the Solveig (Betty is of Nordic, indeed Norwegian, heritage, right?--why?) to Don's Peer Gynt.

If the parallel rings true, I have some good and some bad news for Don. He's prodigal and a rake, but still (and perhaps because of this) wins the heart of the most beautiful girl in the region, a girl socially situated well above his station. Peer (i.e. Don), not satisfied with this great conquest, leaves her in Norway in the cabin he built for her in the mountains in order to take up with various dalliances and business enterprises that bring him hollow success and, in the end, nothing but misery. He is not a "whole man," plagued by sins that he tries to but can't escape. In fact, the Mountain King, in a dream, tells him he's become a TROLL (yikes!). But after he repents his former ways, she takes him back. The moral of Ibsen's retelling of the story is that you have to be "a whole person" before you can enjoy the simple beauty you have. Amazing! Check it out here http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Peer_Gynt

Thank you, theprof, for such an intelligent and sane post. Although much discussed in the past, I had forgotten about the Peer Gynt similarities. I agree with your comments, too, about what to hope for next season. I would like to see more of Anna, as I liked her character and would like more information about her relationship with Dick/Don. She seems to represent the light side of the Dick/Don character, and goodness knows we have seen an awful lot of the dark side, with more to come in tomorrow night's episode, most likely.

I like your avatar, by the way, and such a gentleman you are to refrain from posting first....a thing like that....

I was going to check out the Yahoo group "Sterling Cooper" but I can't join the group. It gives me a "you aren't a member" message but it doesn't give me a place to join. What gives? If anybody who posts there is also posting here, tell me how to join.

You have to open an account on Yahoo, Karenmom. The account is free. I joined that site under a nom de plume. See you on the other side.

karenmom - did the same thing to me and i did open a yahoo account - maybe i am stupid???

G, why are Roger and Don at Joan's apartment? Joan has been jonesing for a threesome. Ha!!

http://www.madmenshow.com/page/Mad+Men+Quotes
This is a link to MM quotes. The one on SNL is a scream.
Maybe Roger and Don are asking her to return to Sterling Cooper. Seems out of character for Don to take the time, but he did have a connect with her in the hospital after the mower incident. Does Don "owe her one" for something?
Or, hey, it could just be the threesome thing. Ha!!

stocky-I have a Yahoo account. It seems that the "group" is a closed one.
j9mac- http://tv.groups.yahoo.com/group/sterlingcooper/
That is the link from "nevernottasty" in a post from episode 12
It says you can't enter if you are not a member. Odd.

Anonymous , chillax it was a joke. whats wrong with you?

Betty's advice - either she'll be given advice to hold off on leaving Don until after the election, or, if Henry is really a cad (whichI hope he isn't, beacuse Betty deserves a decent man), she'll get tipped off about his true character.
Don's meeting with Connie - he loses the Hilton account.
Be surprise ending - my guesses
Greg kills himself (would explain Roger in Joans apartment - not sure why Don would be there...).
SC sold and Don out of a job. Or, Pete gets fired for trying to woo his accounts.
Betty moved back to dads house with the kids. (Don't really think this one will happen, I am afraid that we're in for at least one more season of the disintergrationof this family).
While jogging early in the morning, Miss. Farrel gets run over by a statin wagon driven by a pretty blond...(just kidding).

Christina Hendricks (Joan) states “...the finale is pretty shocking. Something happens that absolutely nobody will be expecting."

In order to facilitate intelligent, insightful discussions of this much anticipated episode, I have the following suggestion:
ignore/do not respond to trolls, anonymous posters, and posters attacking any person or group of people. We should only be discussing Mad Men, not each other.

Anonymous, Okay you win.Didn't mean to offend anyone. but if that's what I did, I apologize...

While jogging early in the morning, Miss. Farrel gets run over by a statin wagon driven by a pretty blond...(just kidding).

But when Sally confesses to her mum about taking the car without permission, Betty, in a rare moment of motherly concern, takes the blame for the accident.

Because no one but Don and the late Miss Farrell knew about the accident, she is let off on the basis that Miss Farrell was running on the road and not the sidewalk.

But Don, who doesn't know that she doesn' t know, is now very concerned about his own safety....

So everyone is going to be "Anonymous" from now on? How very original....trying to find an intelligent poster will be like sifting for gold in a stream full of pyrite.

Talking to yourself again ANONYMOUS ? tsk tsk. Or is it LOVESMADMEN.....?

I would post 'anonymous'ly, but then I wouldn't know me from anyone else, and would be vexed at the thought I might have a hateful argument with my own self.
Otherwise, I'm looking forward to the finale, and I like the previously posted prediction that Don will form his own ad agency with Sal and Joan-- and Peggy and Pete, mebbe. Odd how despicable Pete is, but how drawn I am to his forward thinking this season.

Is it closed, that was one of the questions.

Thanks, Tamtam, I needed that laugh. A most Roger-like comment. I shall look forward to reading more of your posts.

"How do you know it is closed." was the question.

And it was answered.

Please read the post clearly.

tamtam: I too am drawn toward Pete's thinking and his character. At first I didn't like him but as the series progressed, I like him more and more. He has had his bad moments, of course, but so have all the characters.

@ Anonymous:..... Using "anonymous" by more than one poster is confusing, if one of "you" writes something someone else would like to respond to, it becomes burdensome trying to figure out which anonymous is which...don't you see? Unless you are all just one person...no, that wouldn't make any sense at all. JMHO

@ G...could you say where you saw Don and Roger "pictured" at Joan's apartment? I must have missed that. Thanks.

Was the question answered? I did not see it either. I tried to sign up but it says "You are not allowed" huh?

Rozsie: Most anonymous posters also add the time of the post they are responding to if it is to another anonymous poster. If everyone has such an issue with this they should take it up with AMC and Lily. They make the rules and it is up to each poster to choose how they wish to post. However, since this season of Mad Men is coming to a close I don't think it really matters for now. Soon, this site will fade until next season.

After reviewing Season 1, I have come to the conclusion that Joan will commit suicide in the Season 3 finale.

PanAm53: Joan seems a bit too strong of a person to do that. However, I always thought Suzanne might commit suicide in the last episode of this season. I know that sounds weird but that's what I think. Of course, I could be way off on this one. I guess we'll find out soon.

Right, everyone here believes that it says "you are not allowed"...............idiot.

Joan isn't even suicidal or would have any desire to die. Where do you get that idea?
How awful.

It is my policy not to reply to anonymous posters.

PanAm: As you wish. We certainly don't mind.

Yea! Now I see how everyone is posting anonymously! It is now an option.
Ms. Farrell is very creepy and I hope she is gone for good.

Anonymous @3:40 a.m.: No, Joan is not the least bit suicidal that we know of. I don't know why anyone would think she'd suddenly jump out a window, etc. No reason to be. To me, Suzanne has more of a reason to be suicidal or at least depressed, what with Don brushing her aside at least for the time being. But this could all be over-dramatization. We will soon see.

JJ is the host of SNL next week

my guess is that joan kills her husband. you heard it first here. the vase was a foreshadowing.

We haven't had any scenes in a police station, yet, have we? I thought some weeks ago we had heard a report that MM researchers had scouted for material concerning the Ossining police station. If the ending is as shocking as Christina Hendricks says it will be, perhaps this is part of it.

Let's see, I'll take a stab at it--
Perhaps Don catches Betty and Henry and, in a fit of rage, does one or both of them in. How melodramatic, though. Doesn't sound like the Don we know. Still, he's been keeping his emotions, his many sins, and lies about his identity bottled up for a long time now. Perhaps the recent catharsis will end in him blowing his stack.
The only characters that look to me as though they're about to crack and do something shocking are Betty or, perhaps, Suzanne. Maybe Jane, but her death doesn't register with me as shocking as would be the death or incarceration of one of the major characters. I don't think Suzanne is listed among the characters for the finale, is she?

Betty looks to me frustrated and depressed enough to do something rash. It doesn't seem to be in her character either, but I do remember her looking kind of deranged slinging that rifle a season or two. Whom would she shoot? Don? (doubt it) Or Henry? Perhaps she's so humiliated on hearing advice about Henry's other dalliances that she does him in. I mean, honestly, what kind of man is this? He has got to be worse than Don. Don actually seems to have a line he won't cross. He won't hit on girls too young for him, for example, and ride them around the office like a pony. (There's another thing about Roger that disgusts him.) But Henry first hits on Betty when she's pregers. If he's willing to cross that line, what other lines has Henry crossed? And Betty knows almost nothing about him--not even that he has a grown daughter (until she figures it out at the wedding?) In light of her anxiety about Don's secrecy, is this not a problem for her?

Or, as I've said before, Betty may take an overdose of pills. Any of these would be both tragic and shocking in the extreme.

Are we sure that the place pictured is Joan's apartment? I can't be sure. I don't think I've seen anybody's apartment from that angle, but I can't think of any other places Roger and Don would be together, except for maybe Connie's home. Those lattice-style folding closet doors look too much like still trendy 60s interior design for him (is that another tiki connection?), unless they're pictured in one of his hotel rooms. It looks sort of like a hotel room door on the other side of them. But if you say it's Joan's apartment, then it must have something to do with her. I just can't think of what would bring them both over there: to bring her some bad news?; to offer consolation?; surely not to offer her a job (Roger would do that himself over the phone, wouldn't he?).

One final thought about last week's episode. Did anyone else notice that in the teasers for that epi, Don was lifting Sally and not Bobby onto his lap to watch the TV reports of the assassination? I wonder why they decided to go the other way with that?

I am excited to see the finale but sad that it's the end. What a long wait we'll have until next season. I haven't been on this site for long but it's been fun reading about all your opinions and predictions. I'm looking forward to next season.
Now, about the Yahoo site. It's closed to new members and I find that disturbing. Isn't that a terribly elitist thing to do? On Nov 8 at 1:53 anonymous replied to questions about the Yahoo site in a rather devensive, sarcastic way. I totally think you don't use your moniker at AMC because you don't want your sorority sisters to find out you're associating with trash from the other side of the tracks. ( I sound a little hurt ) If you are a member of a closed group, why do you come here? If I can't post at Yahoo, why can you come here and reply to my posts? And yes, the Yahoo group IS acting like it's kindergarten. So there. Na na na na na.
This is my last post to this site for this season. Everybody enjoy tonight's episode and I'll talk to all the sane posters next season!

Hint, hint, hint: Sterling, Cooper & Farrell, Inc.

G: Someone else said the picture of Roger and Don could have been Pete's apartment.

I would like to see more of Don's backstory. I still want to know how he became such a savvy suave New Yorker from being a hillbilly from the farm. Somebody, somewhere must have mentored him or else it is too incredible.

This series is so smart in it's historical accuracy that the Dick transformation just has to be cleared up in my mind. Maybe Anna tutored him in the finer aspects of getting on.

I do not trust Henry. Why did his daughter ask him why he was staring at "that woman" during the wedding dance? She sounded suspicious. Maybe he is still married or always getting in trouble for his womanizing. Remember at the Junior League meeting some of the other women seemed to think, (wink, wink,nod,nod) that he had a reputation.

Karenmom, I am a member of the Yahoo site. To the best of my knowledge it is not closed to new members. We welcome new members all the time. It is true you will have to identify yourself in such a way that we can be assured you are not a known troll from this site, but other than that, it is easy to join. Heck, they let me in....how snooty can they be, hmmmm?

I hesitated to join the Sterling Cooper Group when it was first started, but I had so much trouble last week even getting onto this site, and the troll activity had reached such a toxic level, I changed my mind. I now frequent both sites, and am enjoying both. The troll stink is still pretty bad, but at least I have someplace fun to retreat to while this place is being fumigated.

If Betty should leave Don, do you think he would threaten to take the kids to keep her?

Comrade Trotsky, a breakout group from our GradSem has carefully researched the early life of Draper Daniels, the actual Chicago ad man on whom Whitman/Draper is patterned. They are preparing a major presentation, so I do not wish to "steal their thunder," as the general public often puts it. However, I suggest you look into Mr. Daniels for the insight you seek. (I'll suggest also that your preliminary speculation is not far off the mark.)

Does anyone know when the next season starts? I mean, how long do we have to wait for season 4 exactly?

IDK if my last post came through, does anyone know when exactly season 4 will start?

My guess - Roger and Don are at Joan's place because Greg is dead. He gets hit by a truck or killed in a training accident - everyone thinks he'll die in 'Nam, so that certainly won't happen, but he's a perfect character to kill off.

Smileyeyes: In my opinion, Don would never threaten Betty. As strange as this sounds (covering my head), I think he's actually honorable in that sense. Somehow, strangely, he keeps his philandering persona and home-life persona as separate as his his two identities. Do you remember how shockingly violent he was with Bobbi, his dalliance from season 2? He could never treat Betty that way. It's like his 2 personae don't communicate. Of course he has hurt Betty by carrying on the way he has, but Don at home can't seem to realize that well enough to stop. Gosh, it sounds like I'm talking about a real person! Anyway . . .

I think that Don would assume that the children must be with Betty because, as he himself admitted, she's the best mother in the world. I think he really believes that. He holds her up like some kind of perfection of womanhood . . . so perfect, in fact, that it's (she is) unapproachable. It's low self esteem, I suppose, and his attitudes have been damaged by his early experiences (we barely know the details).

Judging from his comments to her at the point of his confession, it sounded to me as though he was surprised that he ever even had a shot with a woman of her calibre. His perspective is painfully pathetic, and almost child-like. Don't you get the sense that part of him, more than anything, wants to be able to bury his head in her lap, like a child, and receive her motherly consolation. No one but Peggy told him last week that things "would be okay." It's like she was mothering him. He, on the other hand, was the one trying to reassure everyone else that "things would be okay."

Betty's a powerful figure for Don--much more than she knows. What would he do without her and the kids they share? I was going to cut into some statement about the art of courtly love, which has so many parallels with this love story, but I'll spare you the boring details.

It is greg who is dead, but from a vase to the back ot the head. Just a heavier piece of glass this time. Probably some Waterford Crystal she recieved as a going away present from Don or Roger and she wants to know if either of them have the receipt.

Double Standards

Don’t think is a new topic, but as I am reading through many of the posts on the site, I continue to be amazed by how effectively Matt Weiner has transported many viewers completely back to the early 60’s upper middle class mind set regarding gender roles.

You could go on and on about all of Don’s infidelities, from screwing Midge while Betty is sick, to his most recent lame affair. This season, after Don nails a stewardess in episode one …Don begins flirting with his soon to be mistress over the phone on the day of his son’s birth. Begins an affair, 2 miles from his home, because he’s “unhappy” - lying to his wife - staying away from his family for his overnight trysts…etc. And all is forgiven when he finally comes clean about his past - even though his mistress is in the car and he NEVER would have told Betty the truth on his own.

Betty, after years of unhappiness, has a quickie one night stand with a stranger, after while separated from Don (who had skipped town for 3 weeks), and she is a whore. Betty considers a future with someone other than the man who has lied to her for years, and she is a bitch.

Don spies on Betty while she’s at the shrink and that’s ok. Betty finally opens the drawer and she doesn’t respect his privacy.

Don has been disappearing overnight for all 3 seasons, leaving his wife and kids alone. He has affairs that jeopardize his kids happiness and he’s father of the year because he has some nice chats with Sally. Betty has always been there for her kids. Is she a great mom? No, she is too cold, but she always tried and as she told Helen Bishop, the kids count on her. She offers them stability.

In our GradSem, the strongest negative passions are aroused by Betty. As Eliza, a genuine Bryn Mawr graduate, exclaimed with fists clenched in fury, "I hate Betty! I HATE that old bitch! Hate her! Hate her! Hate her! I'm sorry . . . ." Many students have commented astutely that part of the audience's reverence for the lovely and sublimely feminine Suzanne is based on their perception of her as, in Eliza's words, "the Anti-Betty."

hi i'm a newb but certainly not new to Madmen. It's amazing how trolls are on every forum, I think I'll write a book about the phenom. Anyway, my prediction had been that Don will be forced to kill girlfriend's brother (something about the business card). I am sitting here watching for the third time the Kennedy episode; it was exquisite. I can hardly wait for tonight's finale. When all is said and done WHAT A GREAT SHOW. P.S. Could we have a spinoff for Joan? What a story that would be!

Hi it's Polly again, why can't I get a post to stick on here?

ok so it posted, ty amc! one more question, why does the sun go on shining?

Whell! Thanks everyone for responding to my inquiry. I know it's not dignified to stomp over to the kid's table, holding my breath in a tantrum. Don't judge me.

@rozsie, and someone else...
I originally said I spotted the photo in last weeks issue of Entertainment Weekly, and that I suspected it was Joan's apartment because of the powder blue and pink wall colors in the background of the photo.
They are both in their overcoats, standing inside a powder blue room with louvered closet doors, the next room through the doorway is that same color pink of Joan's living room.
They both have a slight open mouthed expression on their faces.

I got nothing myself. I cannot imagine that it would be that obvious for Dr. Greg to off himself. Too easy.

Wait, what color are the walls of Sal's place?

G, let's hope Dr. Pig offed himself! And that was a great catch you made. Whatever happened, this can't be good. I just hope Joan didn't kill him. My guess is Joannie called Roger and said there's trouble and told him to bring Don.

And Polly, hi and welcome. Maybe Roger's phone call was to the owner of Ms. Dever's secretarial school and Joan could be the new dean. What a fun spinoff idea. Our Joannie could be the guide and mentor for all the young girls who come to NY with dreams of working on Mad Ave. Can you just imagine the possibilities?

Who are both in their overcoats? I just started posting here, please bring me utd. Oh not Sal!

The message couldn't be more obvious. Suzanne personifies all that was good and fine about red-blooded American females in '63. Betty embodies everything that has gone wrong with women in the ensuing 46 years. Society has been desensitized to this phenomenon because it occurred in gradual stages. Yet when the audience is presented with Suzanne and Betty, epitomizing the contrast so simply and starkly, it is perfectly natural for the human imagination to exaggerate still further Thus Suzanne is perceived as perfect, flawless and wonderful in every respect. Correspondingly, Betty is reviled as a mannish, neurotic, pill-popping, chronically unhappy, shrewish, lesbian-at-heart, self-absorbed, mean-faced old witch.

K. got something.
Joan can't get work, calls Roger with suicide in her throat, and Roger falls back to Don for support...
no no no, wait...
Greg has turned into his Mr. Hyde, while overhearing a phone conversation between Joan speaking sweetly to Roger. Roger hears the crazy scuffle on the open line and rushes over with his boy wonder.

Wait, what color are the walls in Peggy's new place?
Maybe Duck is into that auto-erotic strangling thing that an old perv like him would pick up from an overseas tour.

Deep Dish thanks for the welcome. OMG what a concept. Imagine my Joan as a headmistriss! I do love her, she is my favorite on the show. Such poise, you don't see that too much anymore. Let's see what happens. Can't wait!

Regarding the shocking ending and the various predictions of suicide...

Joan, no way. She's one of the strongest characters on the show. She's not easily rattled by anything. Remember how she quickly made a tourniquet for Guy's foot injury? She never even broke a sweat, and the blood never bothered her one bit. (I wouldn't be surprised to learn about her having a "past-life" in a medical setting.)

I'd say more likely Dr. Greg. He has access to all kinds of prescription drugs. Heck, it could even be an accidental suicide. Even though he joined the Army to save his career, he can't be totally content with the extreme measure he's been forced to take to be a doctor.

And then Roger and Joan (who are obviously soul mates) could get back together.

Milly (hi!) OR...
Greg attacks Joan, she fights back, he falls and hits his head dies (I hope slowly and painfully) Joan calls Roger?

G: You are a natural. "...Duck into that auto-erotic strangling....
LMAO!

karenmom, To join any Yahoo group, you need a Yahoo ID AND to join the individual group. When you click the link you gave, you will see "Join this group" at the upper right of the largest, main frame. Click that for instructions on joining. Hope this helps!

@Win-- I said a long time ago that there really isn't anyone to cheer for in this sad cast of disillusioned, postwar, post-bomb, status-seeking, money-hungry liars. Name one major character whose behaviors or belief systems you would use as model.

I want to say something here regarding those who have taken it upon themselves to judge this talk site and its entire membership based on the midnight ramblings of a few. I take issue with the generalization that there are no longer any intelligent people to talk with here. I resent being dismissed or demeaned because I choose post on this site.

By PanAm53 on November 8, 2009 3:19 AM
After reviewing Season 1, I have come to the conclusion that Joan will commit suicide in the Season 3 finale.

I'll bite. Do tell, what Joan scenes in Season 1 lead you to this conclusion???????

@theprof: exactly!

@Win: You're right about the double standards.

Considering how MW loves to cut scenes together of various characters/places in his previews, I wouldn't put much stock into the Joan/Roger/Don thing. Remember the preview for episode 11 (I think it was 11) where we had Betty in an office saying she'd discovered some disturbing things and MW cut to William leaving the room? This left us to believe William was in the room when she said it. During the episode we learned that William had already left the room when Betty said this.

All weekend, AMC has been running MM promos for this final episode, and in every single one of them, they are clips from previous episodes. Clips that anyone other than an avid viewer/fan would be mislead by. My hubby caught it once and thought Betty was having an affair with Don's boss. We get no sneak peak this week on the main page of this site, and very sketchy previews. The only real clue we get is the name change of this episode from "The Silo" to "Close the Door and Have a Seat".

To me, the real questions are: will MW give us a cliff-hanger via a flashback (the flashback IS the cliff-hanger) OR will the flashback wrap up some loose ends. i.e. how did Podunk Dick turn into Sophisticated Don?

Needless to say, I'll be tuning in tonight to find out!

fifty-two: You go girl! My thoughts exactly!

G, I just got a look at the photo in EW. I see Roger and Don in front of white louver doors - no pink wall, no blue wall. Did you see something else?

BiPolar, you're right about MW using trickery in the previews. Did you notice in the preview when Pete & Harry are talking about being fired - the TV is off. In the show, it is on with the sound off and the CBS bulletin wording on on the screen.

Since my last posting, I have folded a load of laundry and put it away and started a new load. Emptied and re-loaded the dishwasher and started it. In that time, this site once again signed me out. The weird part is, every time it does that it does it AFTER it allowed me to post in this box. I hit submit and it tells me I've signed out.

@Deep Dish: I missed that part of the previews but it doesn't surprise me.

@fifty-two: You were right then and you're right now:
"there really isn't anyone to cheer for in this sad cast of disillusioned, postwar, post-bomb, status-seeking, money-hungry liars." If these were real people and you knew them, would you hang around with them?????

@Deep Dish, are you calling me crazy? I know what I saw! The walls are powder blue and Joan Pink. I saw it... with my own...
I'm not crazy!
It was there... in the picture in the issue... Roger and Don...
It's there. I'm not crazy. Don't judge me.

Contrary to some preceding mean-spirited slurs, the cast includes a number of quality human beings who deserve our sympathy and admiration. The Draper children. Trudy Campbell. Miss Farrell. Anna. Rachel. And we could only pity the senile Grandpa Gene while he was with us. Carla is inoffensive enough, too, though certainly a clumsy stereotype. Sal as well. We should not permit our bileous rage toward reprehensible sewer-scum like DonDick, Peggy, Pete, Betty, Roger, Connie, Lane and Greg to poison our attitudes toward everybody else.

Don... I think of him a little like the Ted Bundy of philanders. Ted was a good looking, and in some people’s opinion, charming, serial killer that had tons of support from parts of the public . Don is a good looking, charming serial philander. There will always be a segment of the population that goes for this type.

Think of all the men in prison serving life sentences who are the object of desire for lonely women.

Some women are attracted to the "bad boy", but there is another group who somehow think they'll save him...

Anyone who thinks Don loves Betty, the teacher, or any other woman, is missing the fact that he is a user.

Betty legitimized his new identify. All of the other women, in one way or another, gave him an outlet for Dick - he used them. The teacher is just the most recent example. There really wasn’t any reason for him to break it off with her - Betty hadn’t found out about her. He broke it off, because he no longer needed her - she was a outlet for his secret persona, with that a secret no more, poof, she is of no real use to him.

Serial philanders, like the killer counterparts, are loners.

G, no offense, but perceptions of colors can be altered by drugs and alcohol. You're positive you see a certain color, but that's not the color everyone else sees. It's nothing to get upset about.

G, sorry, I wasn't clear. I did not see the actual magazine, but a copy of a photo with Roger & Don in front of louver doors. I'm not sure if the photo I saw is maybe cropped. I just didn't see what you described and that's why I asked. No insult intended.

Of all of Don’s mistresses, Farrell is the most selfish. She actually knows Don’s family and is willing to break up their home because she can’t resist screwing dad. As an educator, she must understand how damaging this could be to the kids. This is 1963. There was a tremendous social stigma attached to divorce that impacted the kids too.

Her dad died when she was a kid and she is willing to take actions that could result in Sally “losing” her dad.

Pete Fan, scary but true. John Wayne Gacy, a Chicago serial murderer, got several marriage proposals while on death row.

Pete Fan, you're right about that. John Wayne Gacy, a Chicago serial killer, got several marriage proposals while on death row. Go figure.
(sorry if this appears twice - posted but didn't see it)

Maybe next season AMC will get things right.

G, no, you are not crazy. I have checked my copy of EW, and yes, the picture is there exactly as you described, pink wall and everything. I thought for awhile it might have been Sal and Kitty's apartment, but after looking at the photos for different episodes, I am pretty sure it must be as you suggested, Joan's apartment. Don and Roger have rather serious expressions, don't they, although Roger's is a tad more blank than Don's, as though Roger was getting ready to drop one of his Rogerisms on us.

Fifty-two, my dear, you are one of the very reasons why I still come to this sight and fight my way through the noxious fog of troll droppings. There are many sane and intelligent folks still posting on this Forum, and that is why I will not abandon it. I look forward to reading all of your comments on tonight's last (oh, say it ain't so!) episode of the season.

@ Deep Dish...

I like the way you think! Your Greg demise...

"Greg attacks Joan, she fights back, he falls and hits his head dies (I hope slowly and painfully), Joan calls Roger?"

...makes more sense than mine did. Greg has proven that he's capable of getting physically violent after that rape scene. And Joan would definitely fight back, this time -- especially since she went "all in" with Greg by marrying a promising doctor who's now turned out to be a flunky.

I also agree with you about Peggy being used by Duck (from the Predictions thread). I get a little impatient with Peggy's naiveté, but her Catholic upbringing probably has a lot to do with that.

@Deep Dish, don't worry. I never feel personally insulted. My last post was yet another attempt at humor. I'll say anything for a laugh. I'm needy for laughs. Don't judge me.

@zerelda, thanks. Yay, I'm not crazy.

I hope they bring me back for the finale.

G, I'm glad, no judging here.
But you are just a little crazy.

just kidding

GOOD EVENING FELLOW-MADDICTS!

Thank-you for the above as-per-usual Lovely Pre-show Intelligent banter! I, too, was a wee bit caught in the snare of the TROLL-SHOW end of last epi. . .

An Aside: I think it is so interesting and strange that we began this season (on this forum) w/ a plethora of posters called "anonymous" and are now ending the season w/ the same calamity. Hmmm.

It is fortunate for us ALL, to have the Luxury and Opportunity to be able to "comment" on many, many sites pertaining to "Mad Men"; here, there, and everywhere. There has arisen a wee bit of contentiousness about the newly structured Yahoo-Group Discussion about our FAV series. I so appreciate the ability to "speak" w/ many if not ALL Maddicts whether they are here or there; WHAT A PRIVELEGE!

I told the founder of the other site: It's like Dagney Taggart (ala "Atlas Shrugged") flew through the mirror at the top of the mountain-range and discovered that she was home, among her best peers. The stalwarts that had been holding the society/culture together had all but disappearred!? (Since convening on "the other side").

I was so comfortable in that place, but my Heart, despite the recurring "anonymous" dischord, beckoned me back here.

FYI: Racy is not well and sends her BEST. She'll be BACK in Spades SOON!

GREG: Where Are you Darling?; We are "Chomping-at-the Bit" to chat w/ you BABY!

I am extremely MELANCHOLIC that this is to be our last episode until AUG 2010!? CRUEL, on the part of the whole SHE-BANG, I think! DOG-GONE IT!

NONETHELESS: next season w/ the Advent of the mid-Sixtie's COUNTERCULTURE mvmt: EVERYTING will be RADICALLY different; for better or worse!

HAPPY MM EVE!

CHEERS!

To all: we're all crazy over this show! It's a good thing - stand tall, be proud! Okay, I'm losing it....

Alright, I'm weighing in: Yes, it is Joan's apartment and yes, Greg is toast! TOAST! He is finally going to get what he deserves (well, no, what he deserves would happen if he was in general population but...) after hurting Joanie. She definitely calls Roger and maybe Roger is with Don when he gets the call. Roger does seem to be reaching out to people. I think Joan was first and Don might be next.

Finally, @G, that whole Duck doing the auto-erotic thing? Man that was the best. I really needed that laugh. This site has had me down for days.....

Does anyone who posts here see MM before 10pm?
I just checked the times and we don't see it here until 11:00 ..yikes. I can't stand waiting that long,

@fifty-two: I'd just like to make it clear that all I have ever said or offered is a troll free environment. I have never once stated that people who remained here were "less intelligent".

I cannot stop others from posting what they feel - and if you notice, most of the posts were anonymous (and possibly posted to slant that way). I have also mentioned that we are not "post on our site only". We've always said it wasn't "either/or".

I'm sorry if someone made you feel that way. It is not our intention to make anyone choose (hence, some of our members still post here). I think some people feel the need to denigrate one side or the other, but that's not how I feel. I just prefer to post without trolls. If you're able to ignore them, good for you. It ruined the experience for me and several others.

My best to you as always.

Helen, what time zone are you in? It airs in Chicago (central time) at 9:00.

Theprof - I like your thinking - get everyone back where they belong. However, I'm not very sure MW thinks the same way. He said the episode was all about change - but wouldn't it be neat if the change was getting everything back to "normal?" (As normal as this group gets, that is.)

I've wondered if perhaps the big upheaval is Joan dying in some fashion. Or perhaps, going with the Peer Gynt analogy, Anna turns out to be the Solveig of the piece, as of course, Don did buy her a house - maybe that's why he has the deed - to remind us. He realizes she is his true love and sets up a sane life with her.

Deep Dish, I am in AZ. We don't suffer the time change twice a year.

Sorry I should have said MST zone.

ATTENTION MAD MEN WATCHERS!!!!!

BLOCKBUSTER NEWS...YOU HEARD IT HERE FIRST!!!!!

TONIGHT'S EPISODE WILL BE THE SERIES FINALE FOR MAD MEN!!!!!!!

I HAVE IT ON GOOD AUTHORITY THAT MATT W. IS DONE WITH THE SHOW AND THIS WILL BE THE LAST EPISODE!!!!

ENJOY...BECAUSE THE SERIES ENDS TONIGHT!!!

IT WAS GREAT WHILE IT LASTED...TIME TO MOVE ON.

PEACE.

MM airs at 10pm (eastern). I am so glad to see so many of my favorites still post on this sight. Can't wait to see what MW has in store for us tonight. I won't even begin to guess, but I do think both Joan and Anna will play much bigger roles in S4. And I hope the backstories of Don/Dick, Joan, and Henry are explored

Oops, didn't officially sign in - my avatar was missing!

@ fancynancy: It will be interesting to see how the counterculture and anti-establishment plays out in SC and with the Ossining crowd. Wonder how Sally will be affected (she'll be at the pre-teen age).

@bipolarbear: Agree that the previews are purposely misconstrued. AI do hope Dr.Thumbs is dead, but maybe MW is going down an entirely different path. In a way I hope so - I love being suprised.

Now this is the first and last time I am going to say the following:

Trolls: either grow up or go away. If you have nothing better to do that barge into a wonderful and intelligent sight and attempt to contaminate it with your unhappy attitude and poison, then you are indeed pathetic.

OK - I have completed my vent - Continue fellow Maddicts :)

Oh for Pete's sake, Lionsgate signed a TWO year deal with Weiner, covering seasons 3 - just completed - and 4, to come next year.

On another note - maybe Betty and Henry end up in a bad car wreck and leave us hanging until next season as to which, if either or both, survives.

FOR THE RECORD:

FOR THOSE OF YOU WHO HAVE DIRECTV...READ THE SYNOPSIS FOR TONIGHT'S EPISODE...AT THE END IT CLEARLY STATES:

"SEASON FINALE,SERIES FINALE"

FEEL FREE TO APOLOGIZE ANYTIME!!!!

@BBK, @Keisha888, @MadMenSuze, @fancynancy, @SCfan, @wasthere, @zerelda: I responded to all your posts in "The Beatles 1964 Memories" Open Thread. Thanks to everyone who posted, and please MM & Beatle fans, Keep posting!

ehbuchan - very interesting postulation about Sally being the driver of the car that kills SF - Betty takes the rap, Don lives in fear - if MW bows out after season 4, maybe you can take over! ;)

That report is accurate. As they say, "It's a wrap." Mad Men hits the dusty trail after tonight.

@Trotskyaire and goodstuff
thanks for telling me how hilarious I am.

Oh yes Alby, directv is ALWAYS right.
Weiner has a signed contract.

WILL THE REAL MADDICTS PLEASE STAND UP!

AMC, Lily, or whoever had the power to erase all of those negative comments: much appreciated. Now one more to be eraticated....

@Racy: Feel better soon

everyone enjoy the show

8 MINUTES

Hope and expect they'll get any of the laws right. I've seen a lot of conjecture about things like Betty claiming marital fraud to get an annulment or divorce, or ratting Don out to the Army. Here's the law on that. In NY, to get an annulment, you have to file the claim in the first 3 years of the marriage. To get a divorce, you have to prove (not just a confession, hard proof) adultry. Things were VERY different then, and in NY. As far as the desertion thing, there is a 5 year statue of limitations, following a 3 year waiting period after the end of hostilities. So once it was past 8 years from the end of the Korean war (around 1960), Don was free and clear. The only way there is no statue of limitations would be if charges had been filed. And they had NOT been.

Another poster said:

Fifty-two, my dear, you are one of the very reasons why I still come to this sight and fight my way through the noxious fog of troll droppings. There are many sane and intelligent folks still posting on this Forum, and that is why I will not abandon it. I look forward to reading all of your comments on tonight's last (oh, say it ain't so!) episode of the season.

I say: Amen!

Re: My prediction of suicide for Joan. C&P from my post on another site...

I was not a believer in the popular theory on the talk forums that suggested allusions to the suicide of either Suzanne, Greg or Jane. In fact, I held the belief that Suzanne might be murdered. I cannot see any reason why Jane would commit suicide, and even Greg seemed to truly believe that his career as a surgeon was back on track with the military.

I hope that we will not be disappointed, but I am anticipating a shocking and truly unexpected Season 3 Mad Men finale. This is, after all, the first time that MW has withheld advance copies of an episode from critics. Joan's suicide would most certainly fit the bill!

Up until just recently, I could not understand why the character of Joan had such a cheering squad of fans. Most of the fans, having not been adults in the early 60s, believed that Greg had indeed raped Joan, yet they did not condemn her for marrying him anyway. I am one of the older folks who believe that what occurred between Joan and Greg would not have been considered rape at that time, but still question Joan's motives for the marriage. Frankly, it made her seem like a gold digger to me. While discussing this point on this forum, I came to a very sad realization about Joan: she felt that she did not have a choice. Even though she had a good job, and would be able to support herself, she was brought up to believe that, in order to be successful in life, she needed to marry a successful man who would take care of her. A man was the key to her self worth. Discovering that Greg was not the successful man who she believed him to be, means that she is a failure. Out of all the other characters, I believe that Joan is most likely to be suicidal.

After reviewing Season 1, I saw that the theme of suicide and, in particular, the suicide of Marilyn Monroe has been occurring since the inception of Mad Men.

Joan is a red-headed carbon copy of Marilyn. In one of the earlier episodes, in a scene between Joan and Roger, they discuss the movie "The Apartment" and Joan mentions the "poor girl" who was driven to suicide. Then there are the more recent allusions to suicide which have been discussed here.

Yeah! Go Bert!!!

Congrats to those who predicted the buy-back!

Oh my god, THIS IS AWESOME!!!!!

Is Peggy crazy, or crazy like a fox??

This is better than I imagined. Betty's not crazy, she's just incredibly naiive

Well, Gail-- I guess we're just the victims of our own hyper imaginations. Archie got kicked in the head, and lightning spooked the horse.

Don's made alot of enemies at SC

Sorry everyone! Pete's stupid fruity pink from door!
Ugh! Don't judge me.

Okay, I don't think I have EVER watched a show and had my mouth literally wide open in shock!!!

I'm sorry I'll stop......can't help it.....BRAVO!!

I can't breathe! This definitely feels like the ending of the show..they're wrapping up all loose ends. The show won't go on, I believe it's over.

Joan knows!!!!!!!!!!!!!

OMG, everything is happening so quickly. What is the deal with Don and Peggy. Please explain - I'm so overwhelmed!

Roy Orbison........song?

WOW!!!!

And NOW what am I supposed to do Sunday nights from 9PM to 1AM?!?

Matthew Weiner finally shows us: He Takes No Prisioners!!

And, once again, Ken Cosgrove plays his role: Clueless!

It was a great ending, and a great beginning .... we'll see.

Cannot believe their marriage is over! I actually feel for him.... that dynamic was too good for the show. Don't jump the shark. Please.....

And, once again, Ken Cosgrove plays his role: Clueless!

Ignore the doomsday fools. They just love to spoil a party. Everyone with a brain knows it's coming back next season.

And, once again, Ken Cosgrove plays his role: Clueless!

Hummmm
All we need is Sal and the one legged Englishman and we have my island of misfit admen

hi do any of you happen to know the song from the season finale promo commercial that has been on tonight and the week leading up to to tonight?

by far, BEST episode! well done everyone who contributed to Mad Men!

p.s. What do I do until Mad Men season 4 comes???

now that's what i call a season finale!
Brilliant! Congratulations to Matthew and the entire cast for an outstanding job! All I want for Christmas is season 1, 2 and three on DVD!
(and my two front teeth). lol

anyone knoww henseason four starts?

now that's what i call a season finale!
Brilliant! Congratulations to Matthew and the entire cast for an outstanding job! All I want for Christmas is season 1, 2 and three on DVD!
(and my two front teeth). lol

anyone knoww henseason four starts?

I knew that scene with Dub & Betty in the bedroom would take place. It wouldn't be a divorce without starting with an ugly scene.

I knew that scene with Dub & Betty in the bedroom would take place. It wouldn't be a divorce without starting with an ugly scene.

now that's what i call a season finale!
Brilliant! Congratulations to Matthew and the entire cast for an outstanding job! All I want for Christmas is season 1, 2 and three on DVD!
(and my two front teeth). lol

anyone knoww henseason four starts?

Is the show over? There will be a season 4, won't there??

AMC just advertised the shows coming up in 2010 and it said "Man Men Season 4____" then it said the month, but I missed it.

Perhaps I just answered my own question! LOL

EXCELLENT finale, excellent!

Seems like an ambigous ending for the series, if it's an ending...leaving the door open to either a season 4 or a continuation at some other point. As for the season finale, it's been heading this way and to be true to the ad biz, every creative (and maybe account, who knows what they're in the business for) wet dream is to quit and start an agency. So there it is. Of course it's obvious, yet needing to be noted anyway that Don's personal and business relationship --official ones -- are ending at the same moment. There much more that can be said about both.

sstnt: I explained the Statute of Limitations long ago but there was some typical internet "lawyer" on here posting that it was from when a crime is discovered. This actually would only apply to murder and besides all of this would be under the military code.
In NY at that time the main cause of action for divorce was adultery but I believe there may have been a couple of others as well but none would apply in Betty's case. We really have to bring back at fault divorce because marriage is a contract and only a breach of that contract by one or both of the parties can disolve it.There should be no such thing as "no fault" divorce and the person suing for divorce should be made to prove a breach of contract. There are far too many frivolous females around who believe that they can get a divorce for trivial reasons like just not being happy or they found a better deal $$$ elsewhere. You breach a contract you don't get rewarded, you pay a penalty.

Roy Orbison's "Shahdaroba" ended the show.

In season 1, isn't it Archie (Dick/Don's father) on the platform with Adam and Abigail (Dick/Don's step-mother) when Dick's body is returned from Korea?? Tonight it shows Archie dying when Dick/Don is 10 years old? Is the continuity girl asleep at the typewriter?

Does anyone know when season 4 will begin? Will it be in the summer as the past ones or is there a chance we may not have to wait that long?

@Alby and the rest.
Given how long it takes messages to post, this may already be responded to, but
CONFIRMED
MAD MEN PICKED UP FOR FOURTH SEASON
Once again,
MAD MEN WILL BE BACK NEXT SEASON
This was confirmed on Sept. 1st of this year.
http://blogs.amctv.com/mad-men/2009/09/press-roundup-0904.php
Here's another source.
http://www.nydailynews.com/entertainment/tv/2009/09/01/2009-09-01_mad_men_will_be_back_for_a_fourth_season.html
Whoever put "Series Finale" on the Direct TV synopsis was incorrect.
Comments on episode to follow in the AM when I am more alert.

Sheesh, if they DO have a season 4 it's starting from scratch. No more Don and Betty, no more Sterling Cooper.
MW is crazy like a fox. Don't know if there'll be a season 4? Tie everything up in a ribbon....which you can unravel pretty easily if it does come together.

Don't be fooled by the trolls. Mad Men isn't done. It was already reported that AMC picked up the show for a 4th season in 2010.

http://blogs.amctv.com/mad-men/2009/09/press-roundup-0904.php

How long do I have to wait for the season 4 premiere? I have watched all three seasons in the last three weeks, just in time to watch tonight's finale. Now I can't just watch it when I want and actually have to wait it out. what is going to happen to the new look sterling cooper!?!?!??! I can't handle the anticipation... Seriously this is the best show on T.V.

When I saw Joan boogie thru the door, I was like, "ALLLLLLL RIIGHT!!!":) Anybody else???:)

Mad Men Reboot!

All this season people having been pushed out of Don's professional and personal lives. Now, in less than 60 minutes it's all been pulled back together. Bravo!

One footnote: where is Sal? He was the obvious missing piece of the SC staff that the no SCDP firm will need.

@Alby and the rest.
(So help me, this post better not show up twice!)
Given how long it takes messages to post, this may already be responded to, but
CONFIRMED
MAD MEN PICKED UP FOR FOURTH SEASON
Once again,
MAD MEN WILL BE BACK NEXT SEASON
This was confirmed on Sept. 1st of this year.
http://www.nydailynews.com/entertainment/tv/2009/09/01/2009-09-01_mad_men_will_be_back_for_a_fourth_season.html
Whoever put "Series Finale" on the Direct TV synopsis was incorrect.
Comments on episode to follow in the AM when I am more alert.

My apologies if this is the second time you're seeing this. Actually, no, whoever didn't allow for enough bandwidth on the AMC server should apologize, but you know what I mean.

OMG is right! When they showed the previews of Don Draper signing his contract, I thought that Don really isn't trapped. He can sign DD until the cows come home. He's really DW and that legal document wouldn't stand up when all is revealed.

Moot point! This story line is great. He leaves and again starts over - on his terms. How are we going to wait for the denouement after this climax?

It all came together tonight! Wonderful. Now for the new adventures of the new Don Draper.

last episode brilliant! , How long do i have to wait
now until you get the show back on TV. My daughter and I are always trying to figure out what you are going to do next, and how you were going
to get Joan back on the show, well now we know.
However since there is nothing else on TV I want
to watch please please Matthew get back to work!!!

ONE question: WHEN does season 4 start????

The Orbison song is "Shahdaroba".

Four men shooting themselves in the leg - love it - what a great, great finale. Looking forward to seeing Sal again. Happy to see Joan is back and looking forward to seeing Peggy grow up.

wow - this is going to be so painful - MadMen withdrawals... When does season 4 start?

Thanks for a great season; this show is phenomenal. If I wasn't working to finish up a couple jobs tonight I'd be celebrating with a nice big dirty vodka martini!

A toast to the crew who keep us wanting more more more.

a big fan

Don was on fire in this episode! Letting Connie have it, getting Bert Cooper fired up, yanking Betty out of bed, kicking the door down, Go Don! Betty hardly knows Henry, did relationships begin that fast in those days? Mad Men is the most exciting show and Don Draper is Mr. Fabulous!

lov lov lov final Mad Men, cant wait till new season wow

Can someone please explain that cryptic converstion between Peggy and Don? I just need a reminder - I know he knew the circumstances of her pregnancy, but iI'm not sure what they were talking about tonight. Help!!

Bravo!!!!! "We have tea."

Did Betty really leave her kids with Carla for 6 week while she is in Reno?

Monty: Your discussion of "no fault" divorce overlooks the obvious. In any contract, if both parties want to tear up that contract and cancel everything that was agreed to, what's to stop them? That seems to be the basis of "no fault" divorce: if both parties want to rip up the marriage contract that's reason enough to do so. Any grounds for divorce (e.g., adultery) really only serve to allow one party to pursue an end to a marriage. There's my Internet lawyering for the day. :)

Gee, i love this show but it makes me want to start smoking again....and drinking more!

@good stuff said Roy Orbison song...yes, I think, but which one???

Bravo!!!!!! "We have tea.

Did Betty really leave her Sally & Bobby with Carla for six weeks, while she is Reno?

SCDP Who's the P? Price? I thought Pete Campbell wanted and then earned his name on the shingle... errr the suite at the Peabody? - Price the brit correct?

Pretty stupid/hilarious drunk dial parody..

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=394X5rcs6Mg

I believe season 4 begins next August (Jeeze Louise...)I knew Roger was referring to Joan when nobody knew how to get everything together, and he said that he know who knows! Brilliant.
Maybe Henry really is wealthy and willing to take care of Betty and kids. Sad that she is going to live in Reno for 6 weeks and leaving kids with Carla.

KitKat: It is not Archie, Dick's biological father, waiting on the train platform. It is Uncle Mack, the man who Abigail "took up with" after Archie died. Abigail was pregnant with Adam when Archie died. Supposedly, Dick and Adam have the same father, and are half brothers.

Great Season Finale.

Sets up for a fantastic 4th season.

BRAVO!!!

If the show continues to ruin Betty and Don's marriage and ruining Betty as the wholsome loving wife, I will refuse to watch the show anymore or any show on AMC!!!!!!!

Betty SUCKS -- nice way to ruin your kids' Christmas -- this could not wait until after the holidays??? Bobby was clearly terrfied.

To KitKat,
The man on the train platform with Adam and Abigail was Abigail's new husband "Uncle Mack", who is Adam's father, not Archie. Don had said that Uncle Mack was kind to him, in contrast to Archie.

WE'VE BEEN ROBBED!!

Old Don skinned Duck once again.

If Bert & Roger still own the building, wouldn't it be a pisser if they opened up downstairs?

Peggy needed Don to tell her how she was valuable to him. He told her she had vision which no one else had. She understood how Kennedy's death changed everything.

He told Pete how forward-thinking he was with aeronautics, teenagers and the Negro market. Both Peggy and Pete had been waiting for those accolades for some time now. Pete offered Don his hand, and this time, he shook it.

I wanted to see the Drapers' Christmas, but it looks like the kids will spend it with Carla at home and with Don at his hotel. I hate to admit it, but I loved Don shoving her around in her little-girl nightgown. She's only taking the kids because she knows it will hurt him. Cruel bitch couldn't even shed a lousy tear for those babies!

Do not understand Francis! This is not well-written.
Love Roger back with Don!
Love Joan!
Don's reliance on Peggy makes no sense.
So happy Don is going to be a free man. I'll take him! ;)
Love the double standard --Peggy is a whore, but Don is just a man. Meh

I hope that they get back to the "Advertising" angles...the main topic of the show is least offered

Thought the show was well written, logical, and inspiring, given the heaviness of the time period and the personal travails of the characters.

Betty seems particularly gullible--night flight, infant in tow --or maybe just that miserable?

Anyone else think that baby Gene is NOT Don's child? Remember, Betty did have that fast and dirty in the bar restroom over a year ago....

Don already has a new family; that long shot of the the hotel room full of unrelated people--yet again. However, this time he may come out ahead, both playing his cards and putting them on the table.

Will the show continue? Hope so. Loved the limited commercials. If Lionsgate doesn't want it (can't afford Weiner) hope that HBO will pay for it.

Pretty hopeful stuff in Roy's "Shahadaroba."

Where the Nile flows
And the moon glows
On the silent sand
Of an ancient land

When a dream dies
And the heart cries
Shahadaroba
Is the word they whisper low

Shahadaroba, Shahadaroba
Means the future
Is much better than the past

Shahadaroba, Shahadaroba
In the future
You will find a love that lasts

So when tears flow
And you don't know
What on earth to do
And your world is blue
When your dream dies
And your heart cries
Shahadaroba
Fate knows what's best for you

Shahadaroba, Shahadaroba
Face the future
And forget about the past
Shahadaroba, Shahadaroba
In the future
You will find a love that lasts
Shahadaroba

Don't tell me I'm the first to mention that Trudy was entertaining Don and Roger with the chip 'n' dip...

Peggy needed Don to tell her how she was valuable to him. He told her she had vision which no one else had. She understood how Kennedy's death changed everything.

He told Pete how forward-thinking he was with aeronautics, teenagers and the Negro market. Both Peggy and Pete had been waiting for those accolades for some time now. Pete offered Don his hand, and this time, he shook it.

I wanted to see the Drapers' Christmas, but it looks like the kids will spend it with Carla at home and with Don at his hotel. I hate to admit it, but I loved Don shoving her around in her little-girl nightgown. She's only taking the kids because she knows it will hurt him. Cruel bitch couldn't even shed a lousy tear for those babies!

Shahadaroba
Where the Nile flows
And the moon glows
On the silent sand
Of an ancient land

When a dream dies
And the heart cries
Shahadaroba
Is the word they whisper low

Shahadaroba, Shahadaroba
Means the future
Is much better than the past

Shahadaroba, Shahadaroba
In the future
You will find a love that lasts

So when tears flow
And you don't know
What on earth to do
And your world is blue
When your dream dies
And your heart cries
Shahadaroba
Fate knows what's best for you

Shahadaroba, Shahadaroba
Face the future
And forget about the past
Shahadaroba, Shahadaroba
In the future
You will find a love that lasts
Shahadaroba

I just hope this is not the last episode, this is the best TV I have seen in many years. Please no blood and violence! People of this time and in this place did not need to resort to that. They cut you up and spit you out by their brains, cunning and courage, much more dangerous and exciting to watch. I don't think we have seen the last of Betty, I think she is going to find her new man just a little dull after Don. I can see Don's children by the end of the sixties and early seventy's. Not pretty. Women in business just started to be appreciated and I want to see that evolution. This show has deserved every award it has received and then some. Please, more, more! This will be one of my favorite episodes, however.

Can someone help me? I'm going bananas trying to find the musicused in the closing moments of the finale. The word "Shahadaroba" are repeated throughout, but that isn't the name of the piece. Nor can I determine who the artist is. I feel I know that voice. I cannot see it in the credits either.

Can anyone help me? It's haunting me@
Thanks,
Lee

PanAm53: Thanks for clearing that up. I guess in my mind it was Archie on the platform. Tonight's episode ended and I can't wait till season4. The breaks are sooooo long.

Pete and Peggy are sticking with Don . . . huh? Sickening! They're still trying to win his love and approval. They'll never get out from under than man's shadow.

Am I looking into this too much? Did Betty leave Don's childred at home and took Henry's child "Gene" with them? That would be a major upset. I knew she wanted an abortion and I figured and thought it was Don's? What do you think. I know that he didn't like the name "Gene".

Lee from Laverne: Roy Orbison

The message couldn't be more obvious. Suzanne personifies all that was good and fine about red-blooded American females in '63. Betty embodies everything that has gone wrong with women in the ensuing 46 years. Society has been desensitized to this phenomenon because it occurred in gradual stages. Yet when the audience is presented with Suzanne and Betty, epitomizing the contrast so simply and starkly, it is perfectly natural for the human imagination to exaggerate still further Thus Suzanne is perceived as perfect, flawless and wonderful in every respect. Correspondingly, Betty is reviled as a mannish, neurotic, pill-popping, chronically unhappy, shrewish, lesbian-at-heart, self-absorbed, mean-faced old witch.

Are you kidding with this shit? Do you honestly expect people to buy this?

Watching the rerun right now and Harry's surprise was priceless. Roger's "Happy Birthday!" remark was perfect.

Paul realizing he'd been left behind was a long time coming, too.

@485Madison and @MjinGA - Agreed. Unbelievable that Betty went off to Reno for 6 weeks and abandoned them while she quickie-divorced their father!! She is truly heartless and the debate over her motherhood skills rages on. As Don said, "God knows they'll be better off....".

So, line of the night? I humbly offer the following:

Don - "I can't believe he was going to leave"
Roger - "The little shit"

Okay, maybe not the line(s) of the night but pure gold anyway!

I thought the show was definitely renewed fornext year.

So, who else is going to be in the firm next year?

Anyone here ever heard of GOOGLE??

It's a Roy Orbison song

http://www.metrolyrics.com/shahadaroba-lyrics-roy-orbison.html

Pathetic.

Great Finale! Great idea Start a new Sterling Cooper Draper Pryce Agency..and bring our favorites..Don, Roger, Bert, Peggy, Pete and Yea Joan's back! Maybe Salvatore & Ken will join too!

LOVED THE FINALE !!!
Can't wait to re-watch the full season in re-runs in the interim.
I HOPE we do NOT have to wait until August 2010 for the 4th season. Network series shows end in May and re-start in September or October - so HOPEFULLY we will get Season 4 in only 4 or 5 months !!!! I'll keep dreaming.
AND Welcome Back Joan - love her sarcasm and witty commentary/replies !!

"Peggy needed Don to tell her how she was valuable to him. He told her she had vision which no one else had. She understood how Kennedy's death changed everything.

He told Pete how forward-thinking he was with aeronautics, teenagers and the Negro market. Both Peggy and Pete had been waiting for those accolades for some time now. Pete offered Don his hand, and this time, he shook it."

This makes me sick to my stomach. This is why I DON'T like the idea of Peggy and Pete being under Don, professionally. They will be constantly longing and demanding "Daddy's" approval like some love starved adolescent children. As long as they remain under Don, they will NEVER grow up emotionally. Never.

What's haunting me is how some folks never read the damn thread when other folks trouble to answer questions multiple times. Sheesh!

Thanks for the lyrics, Paul.

I was very impressed with the acting this time around. The dialogue has never been sharper this season. The scenes with Betty and Don were taunt with emotion and grief at a relationship dissolving into thin air. Certainly, Don deserves further recognition for her acting this episode.

What a nice Christmas present all wrapped up in a Sterling Cooper Draper Pryce bow.

Bye Bye Birdie!

@KitKat: That was Uncle Mack w/stepmom & Adam at the train station.

@Krazy Karl: I'm pretty sure it said "Season" finale, not "Series" finale.

@Maddicts: I agree it was a SENSATIONAL episode and there WILL be a Season 4. The new AMC drama "The Prisoner" looks interesting. I'm sure it won't be as good as MM (nothing could) but it may keep us entertained.

I am just watching episode 313 for a second time now. The line that Don uses on Peggy to get her to join SCDP is absolutely fantastic: "I'll spend the rest of my life trying to hire you." Really powerful!

Sally would not behave in that manner in that era.

Am I the only one who noticed that Peggy is PREGNANT!!!???
The swollen face just like Season1. This gets Duck back into the story.

Also Trudy serves up chip-n-dip in the same bowl Pete exchanged for the .22 rifle

@paul - Wow, those lyrics do pretty much say it all don't they?

And by the way, to all of you who pretty much had Joan in her apartment standing over Greg with a butcher knife......well, that didn't happen did it? Oh, never mind, that was me.......carry on.....

@qoatu54: You must be careful when asking questions such as who is the father of Gene, and particularly mentioning Betty's romp with the guy at the bar. There's no shortage of people who will not hesitate to severely injure your self-esteem for daring to ask such a question (or any question for that matter).

At any rate, Betty was already pregnant when she "hooked up," as the kids say nowadays (although even that still doesn't mean what happened) with the guy in the bar.

Gene's conception (with Don) most likely happened on the floor of a bedroom in Grandpa Gene's house. Betty had "spite sex" with Don to prove she can control him if she really wants to. Now there's a romantic thought.

http://www.amazon.com/All-Time-Greatest-Hits-Roy-Orbison/dp/B0000026T0/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=music&qid=1257742239&sr=8-1

The song's on this CD

Bravo.

Thought this was excellent.

Can I admit that I don't care if Don and Betty get back together?

Very, very good exchanges between characters. I think it's what the episode was built around.

Roger and Don in the bar, informing Don of Henry Francis. They're talking about an older man with a younger woman. Roger said he was sorry, twice. Is it, Roger feeling guilt regarding Mona, as in Don having to find out about being the victim of an older man/younger woman affair like Mona did? The other parallel is Henry is so all about Betty the same way Roger was so all about Jane, look where that is now. But is Roger saying I'm sorry to Don but really almost to Mona? I'm sorry is what Roger should be saying to Mona but doesn't.

Speaking of which, the exchange between Don and Peggy in her apartment, is it the same type of thing? If you look at what he says, not directly necessarily but isn't it really what he should be saying to Betty? He says to Peggy basically, people buy into something and it ends up different because something terrible happened, and the way they saw themselves is gone. No one understands that but you do, you're valuable. That's the conversation he should be attempting with Betty. And other things like "I don't know if I can do it alone will you help me"? Don builds Peggy up and makes an effort toward her as a response to her. But he doesn't make the same type of effort toward Betty.

So the greater point is, he says this to Peggy but should be saying the general tone to Betty and Roger should express grief toward the victim of an older man/younger woman affair to Mona, not Don. More Roger and Don parallel behavior.

Roger when Cooper and Don come to him, Roger resisting at first, saying there's a deck chair with my name on it. It just reminded me of expressions about throwing deck chairs off the side of the Titanic.

Then Roger saying regarding Coop's pitch, "Join or die." Remember Cooper saying, "kill or be killed, that's how I was raised."

Don and his father in the stable, young Don almost bonding with his father, of course over a drink, this time from the jug. And his father saying "I have a silo." I think we found out Don actually took a few things from his father.
But then we see Don seeing his father get kicked in the face. I think that was what his attention to Sally was about, he doesn't want her to see her dad kicked in the face and instead be there for her.

The title, "Shut the Door, Have a Seat." That's what you say when you have to have a talk with someone. What made this episode beyond the obvious plot points, was the dialogue exchanges between them all. The dialogues and everything around them made this really good stuff.

Through that exchange with Peggy and Don we've gotten back to one of the original MM themes about Don/Peggy/Betty. "I won't spend the rest of my life trying to hire you." If you apply that statement to Betty as well, it underscores his whole thing about leaving when he's had enough.

One of the best exchanges was between Don and Connie, Don saying, play around with me (Suzanne Farrell), kick me (Betty), knock me down to size (SC and the contract). Great summation of the whole season regarding Don. So what does Don do here in the last episode?

He leaves.

FWIW, when my husband and I decided to divorce back in the '70s, we were faced with basically the same choices of grounds -- insanity, imprisonment, adultery, or physical abuse, none of which were true in our case. We were very fortunate that irreconcilable differences was about to become grounds on its own in our state, and we waited the few months till then. Otherwise, we would have had to perjure ourselves and ask our friends to do the same as "witnesses". Of course, ours was a far more amicable split than Don's and Betty's!

My point is that "no fault" divorce hasn't always been an option, that's all. I do admit that I have no clue when it became sufficient grounds in NY.

I think the best bit of the whole show was when Don was in Peggy's apartment trying to persuade her, and he said (words to this effect) that because of recent events, who people used to see themselves as being was gone, and that nobody got that except her. And then he turned on the ol' Don Draper charm: "I'll spend the rest of my life trying to hire you." Love it!

As hard as it was to wait for this season to start, now the long dry stretch begins waiting for season 4!! What a phenomenal set-up!!

@Dee - Ken? Really? I think the point they were trying to make was that Ken was promoted by the "short-sighted" thinkers at PP&L. As opposed to Pete, the more talented account man. I'm pretty sure that when Roger and Don were trying to get Pete to join them and he balked and asked about Ken, they baited him a bit by saying they would talk to him next. Ken was left behind appropriately me thinks.

First off: BRILLIANT show!! WOW! MW can sure tie things in a nice little bow, can't he??
Second: LOVED that Joanie was brought back! GREAT planning!
Third: Where the hell is Sal? As soon as they mentioned that the Art door was closed a bulb should have gone off: SAL! We need Sal!
Fourth: If Betty is going to stay in Reno for 6 weeks, why doesn't Don, the father of her children-owner of the damned house live in the house? Ummm, doesn't Carla have her own family to tend to?
Fifth: Did I already say that this episode was BRILLIANT?! Yes!! May we have tea now?

My favorite part was when Roger asked Peggy for a cup of coffee. Did you see the look on his face when she told hime no. PRICELESS!!!!

Don is so happy! He is free from both bosses in his life!

OK, what does Pryce do? Why was he made partner??

can someone come up with a definitive list of clients for madmen?

Ive got:
John Deere
Seacorp~sp?
lucky strike
heineken
clearsil
pampers
hilton
coke-patio
something about telegraphs
american airlines
aquanet was it?
samosnite
amierican aviation
jai a'lai.
menken department store

what else? successes and fails.. who had what account, its becoming a blur

This episode jettisoned all the plot lines & characters that were dragging on the show and now we are back to what really gave the show fire. We just need Sal back to complete the cast (he will be back).

Also, we are rid of the tedious plot line of Don's hidden life since the previous episode when Betty learned of Don's real identity.

Now, I am looking forward to season 4.

@Greg - I think Don said to Peggy "I WILL spend the rest of my life trying to hire you". Anyone?

@DannyS: I thought he said that he won't spend the rest of his life trying to hire her.

Don was not talking to Peggy just about how JFK death changed people--he was referring to her giving birth and not being the same anymore-she got teary-he knew she would understand that how things change people-and he was thinking about himself with something bad happening too. Very, very well written.
Did you notice Pete got the Clearasil account back?
Proud, happy Trudy probably called Daddy for that.
AMC lets us post anon to show that Madmen is for everyone who loves it-not a snotty few who had to have their own prom because they didn't like anyone but their own kind.

Shahadaroba, Shahadaroba
Means the future
Is much better than the past

Shahadaroba, Shahadaroba
In the future
You will find a love that lasts

[ Roy Orbison Lyrics are found on www.songlyrics.com ]

@Fifty-two: Thanks for the explaination. I hooe you weren't referring to me for not appreciating the feedback. I do. And I do read all the posts before posting myself. Hence the delay in sending my thanks.

@Greg: Geat insight. I thought that the conversation with Connie set up the whole episode. For once, Don was getting the short end of the deal, and xouldn't understand being used and discarded (in a way). Hasn't that what he has been doing to not only Betty, but even all his mistressess and Peggy and Pete.

@Anonymous 12:51: I thought Peggy was looking a bit "padded" too. Bet she can't wait til birth control is more prevelant....

does anyone know what is the name of the song played during closig credits on season 3 finale?

does anyone know what is the name of the song played during closig credits on season 3 finale?

Thanks Greg for another long winded DUH filled post.

Best line of the ep: Peggy saying "NO" when asked to get coffee. Go Peg!

Our Joanie is not dead! Yea!!

OKAY, I want everyone who made correct predictions to STAND AND TAKE A BOW! Don't be shy, you deserve it.

Pink and blue walls, G, maybe you are crazy? nah.

@Fifty-two - I respectfully disagree about the context of Don's talk with Peggy. I don't believe he was referring to the recent assassination. Instead he was talking about their shared knowledge of her pregnancy and giving up her child which he sees as a parallel to his secret past and how these things changed them both. While Peggy may not know about his secret past, he feels that she can relate to him anyway.

This was the best episode of the whole series ! I was staring wide-eyed, jaw dropping. I especially loved the scenes between Don, Roger, Cooper, and Lane re. buying back SC. Snappy dialogue, especially fm Roger.
I knew when they collectively didn't know how everything "worked," and Roger said.... "Let me make a call..." that Joan was COMINNNG back... and sure enough !
Also, the scenes between Don and Peggy, so original, imaginative.... I'm 67, so I immediately knew what Don meant that "it's gone." Yes, it was gone. I've wondered how they do the Kennedy assassination. Very tasteful and well done.

And thanks for info on the Roy Orbison song at the end. I've been googling it as "Jenna Rova" (sp?) and variations ! Loved the melody and meaningful lyric. Brilliant script.

@goodstuff-I too thought Don said " I will spend the rest of my life trying to hire you" to Peggy. I will have to watch the re-broadcast of this episode, which I thought was one of best all season! I will be lost till S4 starts.

To the Anonymous poster who asked: I listened to this line twice tonight and Don did say to Peggy, "I'll spend the rest of my life trying to hire you."

That statement - that promise - and not a threat by Don that he won't pursue Peggy, was what pushed Peggy over the edge to join SCDP. Peggy was prepared to stand-up to Don's bullying. It was taking a respectful tack that got Peggy. Same approach with Pete.

My prediction for season 4 includes Sal returning as part of the new agency team.....but how will they deal with the Lucky Strike guy hating him? I think they'll keep Sal busy directing in-house produced commercials, as he was beginning to do this season. That way, he won't need to be in meetings with the cigarette man. Sal and Kitty will have divorced in the interim and Sal will be one of the slowly emerging 'out' talented gay men in the creative side of American business. He will adopt the habit of wearing a white silk scarf at all times, for dramatic effect.

I hated season 3 with one exception. Episode 13 was awesome and what I had come to admire about season 1 and 2. To me season 3 was a waste of time except for this last episode which really makes me wish season 4 would start next week. Absolutely loved this episode and look forward to an energetic and hopefully more upbeat season 4. Getting sick of the "Whole world sucks lets all be depressed and miserable" crap that seems to fill every network lately. Not everyones life sucks, SOME people are actually happy and upbeat. (ok maybe not me, but some people)

I don't know why I'm sad about Betty and Don splitting up because their marriage was uncomfortable, angry and dishonest (on both parts). I guess I liked them together just for the dysfunction maybe.

I think Betty is going to get a very, very painful wake up call next season. I imagine she's going to wind up marrying Henry and finding he has no money and the grass really isn't all that greener. Or she'll end up divorced, no Henry, no money and three kids whom she barely tolerates. I love her character and have appreciated how she evolved from a perfect little stepford wife into something with more depth, but not much more sense.

Other clients/campaigns:

Eastman Kodak
Belle Jolie
American Tobacco (Lucky Strikes)
London Fog
Mohawk Airlines
Playtex
Western Union

ALBY -- got kinda' quiet there, huh?

There will be a Season Four, despite what you say.

Don't let the door hit you on the way out.

Goodbye and Good Riddance!

MJinGA: Carla would be far better for the kids than Betty ever will.

k9shep17: Goodbye! Betty is far from wholesome...

Betty is, I believe, getting bad legal advice. She has limited grounds for divorce but perfect grounds for an annulment in that Don wasn't who he claimed to be. It's a sort of "fraud in the inducement" notion and it was part of NY law at the time.

Amazed at the last episode! Lots of action in 55 minutes. My husband and I were cracking up over Bert's "Did you wash your hands??!" And of course all the other little tidbits. I KNEW Roger was going to call Joan, but that's the only thing I guessed right. Love that Don went back to Peggy and had the little heart to heart. I hope to HELL she didn't call Duck in between those talks! And KUDOS to Lane on his response. "Happy Christmas!" Click.
Everybody is complaining about what to do with their empty Sunday nights now, but my hubby came up with a little idea for ME. Ha! Typical male. lol. Well, it's been fun on here, I will enjoy looking at all the posts and eagerly await next August!
@ Christopher Hey Buddy! I've missed you! :)

Hello all Mad Men devotees. I, too, noticed that Peggy was a bit full in the face. Also, regarding the chip n dip bowl, did Pete return one because they had received two?

Oh, and can someone PUHLEEZE make a SceneIt game of Mad Men???? That would be super!

I am so glad that Betty and Don are going to divorce. Loved, loved, loved, how he dragged her around in the bedroom. I'm a woman, and even I wanted to slap her!

Pete looked sexy in his robe and bed head hair. Are we to assume that Ken and beard man (sorry, I can never remember his name) will be off the show now?

It was so funny when the dude from England called Price and told him he was fired. He was like, "OK, cherrio, have a nice holiday. Bye!" I thought he was going to start skipping out of the office.

Betty is an idiot. Seriously, it will not bother me one bit if she is just as unhappy with Henry Francis as she is/was with Don. It would be interesting if Mr. Francis was gay and just needed a woman on his arm for the campaign. Or if he turned out to be an abuser.

I don't think they got two chip 'n dips. They got one (from Aunt Lettie) that's why Trudy was so pissed that he returned it.

But don't ya like how Trudy is stepping up? Pete and Peggy are sharing a desk. Hope Trudy doesn't find out the rest!

I'm looking over the last three seasons and thinking about what we could look forward to in Season 4 just as the rest of you are.

I admire the way the writers use the sale/demise of Sterling Cooper as a backdrop for pulling the cast toward a new frontier.

I was very glad that Peggy finally gave Don the gut shot to his ego he has been needing since Season 2 Episode 3. While I knew the idea of buying SC back was DOA, it did surface several important and very realistic dramatic moments.

Don's epiphany about standing up to the sale of SC (and the flashback to his Dad's death) gave us all some better insight into Don's demons and why he might yet rescue himself from the self-destructive cycle.

As far as Don's getting Betty back next season -- like the company buy back idea --- I just don't see that happening. Betty's loss of her father ,then her on going struggles with self-esteem (note Betty's pick up scene in Rome at the Hilton) and Don's betrayals with the school teacher have opened a gulf between only some truly extraordinary event could bridge. But who knows.

Campbell's resurrection to a status as an account man was a welcome and long overdue event. Like Peggy, Campbell taken his lumps and the worm has turned and is now packing an Uzi.

'Red' (god i am so hot for her) coming back to the office promises an even better drama than I could hope for. Sorry, but I don't think Roger's going to pasture his manhood again with her. She's going to target Don and really make the next season heat up

A couple of thoughts: It's a common plot device in too many movies and TV shows where the angry wife orders the husband out of the house, or at least, to sleep on the couch. Whether the husband in question deserves such treatment aside, why do they invariably comply? If the wife doesn't want to share a bed with the husband, let her find a sofa, or perhaps fainting couch. If the husband is foolish enough to allow her to order him out of his own home, legally he may be charged with desertion. I know it's just a TV program, but I think Don should have stayed at the house. He has little or nothing to lose, and much to gain by doing so. Also, at this juncture, it seems Don has the opportunity to say guess what...I have nothing except whatever is in the bank account and the house. He's technically out of a job. He's a fool to not fight this.

DannyS: Trust that Media Man and Don will Certainly bring Sal Back!

Madtini-It didn't matter what name he used-his birth name or one he gave himself-on the contract. He was the person that signed it and he was the person SC wanted under contract. He asked Lane to fire them to get himself, Coop and Roger out of their contracts.

Sky-I think the company is Secor-their product is a laxative. Western Union is the telegram company.

That was the best episode of the season imo. Had that smart MM feel to it. Loved it! I also can't wait for next season.

Tonight's episode restored my faith in the show. I thought this season was a little off compared to previous ones but tonight's episode was easily one of the best ever. The scene with Don and Peggy was exceptional. I'm really looking forward to next year and the new agency.

For those of you that don't know "Breaking Bad" is also one of the best dramatic series that has ever been on tv. If you haven't been watching that you are missing out big time. I'd also say "Big Love" is another great show. I pick up HBO when it's on for that show alone. Nice to have three top notch shows to watch.

Amazing that AMC is responsible for two of the best shows of all time. How the hell did that happen?

Thanks to Matt and Co. for another wonderful, and this year truly heart-wrenching season. The scene with Don and Betty telling the children about their breakup was perfect--and thus agonizing. I'm not sure what we'll be getting in 10 months but it obviously will be very different. The Don of seasons one and two will have to evolve. He both despised and desired his relationships with Betty and Roger. Now Betty is gone and he has had to embrace Roger again--good bit in the bar--Roger says he "always thought he founded a business when of course he didn't" -- the look on Don's face in reaction--Hamm was terrific. Also Hamm's eyes when Don holds bobby dart to Betty when he says "None of us want this," was great. What is wonderful about the acting here is how subtle it is. I loved Don using his old "Don Powers" but this time for a bit of good--in his pursuit of Peggy. Can Don evolve and still be an interesting character? I so loved his conflict. So few characters on television offer us a taste of what so many of us feel in life --that is a hidden revulsion at the who we are that a mixture of fate and perhaps mistaken choices has left us with. This show has been so pessimistic--why I loved it--the end of season one with Don sitting on the stairs everyone gone for thanksgiving. Last year with Pete holding the shotgun. This was a very optimistic ending.Jan Jones was terrific on the show (and stunning on the cover of GQ) but I wonder how they will keep her in the show now. Fitting in a new love life for Don and a relationship with her as the mother of his children seems like a lot to do.
But bottom line, Don has reached his "Batman Forever" moment. He isn't Don Draper, Madman, because he has to be, but because he wants to be. See you all in August!

I agree, grumpy. When Betty told Don to leave the house, I yelled at the t.v., "NO, why don't you???" It irks me to no end that she took off on a plane with Henry right before Christmas. People still going to argue on here that Betty is a normal mother and that's how it was in 1963? I don't think so.

Till next season, thanks everyone for the great comments. I thought the finale was spectacular.
I also think Betty is still in love with Don and will be unhappy with Francis. She just lined him up to get the nerve to leave Don but she's going to find being a political wife not nearly as much fun as being and ad star's wife.
Oh well, we'll just have to wait and see.
Buh bye for now.

naomi hoppin: I loved your point about Betty! And, the reason I hate seeing their marriage end is because the children suffer.

episode 13 critique from a 21 year veteran of the motion picture biz : PERFECT

They saved the best for last and saved the season for me, what an incredible episode. Too many good moments to even tally. I love Conrad's speech to Don, daring Don to have the balls to do what he always wanted to do in the first place. That scene with Don and Roger leaving the office and Don pretty much saying to him then he never wanted to be an organization man in the first place was also great.

There was also Don and Betty's fight, Don letting Betty go, Carla raising the kids for 6 weeks ( Don was right, they will be better off ) and the Big 3 getting Pryce to become Big #4 and telling Powell to go piss up a flagpole, and lastly Joan enabling the " Sack of Rome " she tried to prevent during election night 1960. But the scene with Don and Peggy was Emmy winning material for both Jon Hamm and Elisabeth Moss, perfectly summing up the this bizarre friendship/mentor-protege relationship/romantic attraction they have for one another. I can't wait to see what they do with the show next.

Goodstuff: Yeah you're right it is confusing because the audio is a little mumbly when you first hear it. I did think he said, "I will" but wasn't sure when I was typing that out and f-f to watch it again and changed my mind.

To me he's kind of shaking his head, and he also said the word no. And given her reaction I opted for thinking he said "I won't". So given the fact that he has said more than once to Betty she's had a bad week or whatever and that's his (ill) way of giving her a chance, then he does end up agreeing to leave and to get an attorney, I guess I see it as he says he won't chase her; both Betty and Peggy. It is a kind of Don thing to say, so that's how I interpreted the bad audio.

to answer another poster on the same subject: Also I think it fits more with the dynamic. Peggy, although not showing it, actually being distraught at the idea of not hearing from Don again even as much as she's combated with him I think fits Peggy and the implied mentor role that was there in the first season. And you have Don rising back up to alpha-male status and taking control telling her goodbye. I just think it fits the MM dynamic that the Peggy character is more likely to respond this way, feeling validation for her efforts, yet challenged.

Burger boy was Mr. Nice Guy and she liked it, but left him just using him. It's not a cliche about nice guys always losing. Instead of kicking her out, he actually helps her to get out by telling her how the locks work and says he'll be around for her, at that same place if she wants. She never goes back to him. Don validates her, but also takes control and the power telling her he won't chase her. She responds to that. Notice when Duck called her last week, he doesn't act all the sweet guy, he tells her what to do. Here it's part Don-business, and part Don-honesty and part Don-working a woman and knowing how this one needs to be worked. That's how I saw it.

But yeah back to Goodstuff: you're absolutely right, it is confusing when you first hear it. that's just how I interpreted it.

Personally I am hoping Better gets written off the show. January does a great job but its a crap character in my opinion. Sick of the whiny crap, they could have done so much more with that character with January playing it but they went the wrong way. If the baby hadn't been on the plane with her I would have wished for an accident so she could drown in a fire.

Knew they were keeping Joan, just cant get rid of her. Christina also does an amazing job on the show.

You can lose the blond (Betty-January) But if you lose Red (Joan-Christina) you're dead [Ratings wise].

Wow! totally didn't see this ending coming.

I am so happy that Betty is getting out of this marriage! I realize she's only known Hentry for 6 months, but she proabably knows him better than she knew Don for most of their marriage. He can't be a worse husband that Don. I hope her character is back in S4. I am afraid that they may write her down to a very minimal role now that she isn't living with Don.

Would love S4 to really focus on the new agency instead of the soap opera stuff that filled most of this season. Sal could stiill come back, they're still organizing.

Ok, we'll try this one more time.......
Someone PUHLEEZE make a SceneIt game for Mad Men!

Does anyone else watch the show with captions on? Why do the captioners refuse to type epithets? "S---" when a character says, "Shit", etc. Pretty unprofessional. (I used to be a sign language interpreter, and the rule is that, if you aren't comfortable with language that is/might be used, you don't take the job; it's not your privilege to censor.)

It's not just MadMen. Breaking Bad has the same problem. I've tried to find somewhere on the AMC site to write to object to the watering down, but no luck.

Just an aside.

Many great scenes and dialog. Peggy understands the complex psychology of people and their needs, and we see why Don's idealism works so well with Peggy's. Sal won't be back, just because of Lucky Strike. So does everyone at the new firm now have no contract, which in itself is liberating. We have a blank slate with Henry Francis, and MW is free to script the dark side of his past. The only thing we felt bad was for the employees in the office, who returned to a gutted SC. And then there is Don's father who railed against the 'corporation' and struck out on his own, only to meet his judgement day. Again, this opens up possibilites of the nacsent firm, running into obstacles such as a huge client not resigning, or someone jumping ship, or some huge legal mess. Joanie coming back means we'll have to put with more whining from Greg, unless....We'll probably see how Bobby and Sally confront divorce, but not a major theme, as Don and Betty are no longer united. See ya next August.

I love all your insights Greg, you are a true pro at this. And @cwood, you too!

Some more good lines:

Pete to Trudy (as Don & Roger ring his doorbel):
"I need to look sick."
Trudy: "You do.".....

Trudy: "I'm going to change the sheets."

Roger to Don: "So you do want to be in advertising after all."

Don to Burt: "I want to build something...you did it yourself 40 years ago."
Burt to Don: "But I'm not sure you have the stomach for the realities."
Don: "Try me."

The first test of "Try Me" comes when Burt makes it clear that Don's going to have to make the case to Roger. Once Don swallows that "tail between his legs" gesture, he then is equally eloquent in his "hat in hand" pitches to Pete and Peggy. Quite a change to see Don Draper actually going to people and for the first time in his life asking them for something when he didn't hold all the cards.

Well now I know why I come to this forum and put up with all the distractions both welcome and not so welcome.
What an absolutely great episode. Truly a masterpiece in the current American cinema/TV world.
Expanding this with some highlights and background of the show you could have had a great movie. Oscar worthy.
There was a lot of suspense as well. Would Pete or Peggy both come along or would one or the other tell them to shove it. That scenario was a plausible option.
Would the Draper split up get down and dirty with Betty playing her trump card of Don's secret life. I guess you could say she did or argue the opposite.
Of course it was great to see Joan integrated back into the world of Sterling Cooper Pryce and Draper. I truly loved seeing St. John so pissed off. As a fan of the Pryce character(please don't to many of you say you liked him all along) it was a delicious moment of the employee sticking it to his boss. As a union worker for 34 years I totally loved the way it has played out. It will definitely cost PPL millions. And after all under all the politeness and British civility as in American buisness , the dollar or pound is all the top brass really care about and the only way to really get their attention.
Kudos to the Draper character to have the balls and brains to suggest that Lane should fire them all.
I also loved seeing Kinsey flummoxed over being left behind. As usual Harry had no idea of what was happening and still comes out of it well. That has been an hilarious story line throughout the season, maybe last year too that i just get a great kick out of.
I am sure someone smarter than me, will find great parallells with Archie's demise and what happened in December of 63 to his son. I look forward to hearing from all Maddicts on this episode.
Now I will go read the previous posts, which I usually do before posting, but I could not wait to chime in this time.

Hello everyone...This episode was amazing! So eventful...

Bert- "you sold your birthright so you could marry that trollop" LMAO

Peggy stands up to Don. And she WAS a nervous poodle most of the time around Don

Joans back!...I knew Roger was going to call Joannie... and Pryce was hilarious when he got
fired

Don and Betty: The bedroom scene was intense. For a moment I thought Don was going to hit Betty. I'm glad Betty left him and that he found out about Henry but I don't see anything good coming out of that relationship. Some feel Betty was cold and harsh towards Don and I can see where they're coming from but I believe her behavior is a result of (not cause of) Dons emotional unavailability. Her mother had died at the beginning of the series and Don coped with it by staying at his girlfriends overnight, pretending to be working hard and telling Betty not to talk about it (her mother)...
I was a bit surprised at Dons reaction when he found out about Henry - After ALL his indiscretions, with no regard to Bettys feelings, he calls her a whore, in a drunken stupor but nonetheless... I think Don is SO wrong. Like Betty said he broke up the family. But at the same time where do you begin with Don. His issues emanate since birth, he doesn't know what a real family is, doesn't know what it's like to have parents. He turned away his own brother. Anna seems like the closest thing to family he has (besides his children).

oh and what happens to Ken,Paul and Sal next season???...I can't wait to see what happens next

Good for Don, and finally I thought MM had jumped the shark when the guy got his foot cut off in the office, but it looks like they were just playing possum. I was right, Don is going to stay the protaganist. But not without suffering losses, but it does look like his empty headed wife is just going to remain a kept cage bird in Mr. Francis's sleasebag world of politics. Thank God this show has taken a turn that give life back to this turkey. I had already started debating watching reruns of Dexter, Nip Tuck, and Lost. Good going Mr. Weiner, if you keep this show true to it's roots, MM will continue to be a top tier show.

First of all, wow that was one Heck of a ride! I see that a lot of people are talking about the dialogue between Don and Peggy, which was good and all but I think the scene that you will think about on your way to work tomorrow will be the one where Don pulls Betty out of bed and confronts her about Henry Francis. This is the best acting I have seen from Jon Hamm yet. It was riveting and full of emotion. When Betty asks Don why he even cares about Henry Francis, Don says “because you’re good and everyone else in the world is so bad”. Betty had surprised Don, He honestly did not think she had it in her to make a chance for a better life with another man. He thought she was too good to do such a thing. He goes on in a drunk trance telling her off and ending with grabbing her and calling her a whore while their baby wails in the background. He looks at her afterwards, knowing that he is wrong, almost surprised at himself for showing this much emotion to her. Powerful, powerful stuff. I have always been a Betty fan, and you can see in this scene she is not talking to the man she married but to Dick Whitman, a man that she never agreed to marry. Call her a snob if you will, but she wants more for herself than a man who can’t even come to terms with the person that he is. Their relationship is a façade, a piece of marketing that Don just couldn’t quite sell to her in the long run. She sees that now and her first instinct is to run away. It is sad to see it end, and I half way want to see Don try to win her back. Jon Hamm deserves best actor next year for this scene. BRAVO!

Also, I did not catch why Pete did not get to be partner.

Most "stand up and cheer" lines:

(After Betty says to Don, "Why do you care?")

Don: "Because you're good and everyone else in
the world is bad!"

(I loved Jon Hamm's conviction when he spit out that line at Betty).

And finally, the piece de resistance of one-liners:
Don to Betty: " You're a whore."
(And the up-and-down scornful look he gave her just before he left the room....great acting)!

LovesMM: a daughter would... who had a mother like Betty.

Jim Kennelly: Well said!

am i the only one that noticed it was Friday the 13th?

Peggy being Preg. may not be a good thing considering how many she has had already. her sister is going to have a fit! were condoms invented? oh, i forgot she was Catholic.

and, Don better be glad this was the 60's... nowadays, Betty would have fallen to the floor, rolled around and made sure she was bruised/harmed, etc.

i cried like a baby at the thought that this is over until next year!!! I love this show and feel that its the best written, created and directed EVER!

Enjoying all the observations, character insights, and little details!

PEGGY’s become a little bitchier, she feels like she has leverage because of Duck. (Is she going to spill the beans to him and can he make trouble?)

JOAN is still torturing Peggy - she’s now assigned to share a desk with Pete! Wearing pants: the office dress code of the future (even though she wasn’t really dressed for work).

DON is Sterling with capital S. He’s lightning quick, the way he processes information and responds to it. He acknowledges how he took Peggy and Pete for granted and expresses why he appreciates them. He compromises gracefully with Roger. In the end he tells Betty he doesn’t want to fight her and hopes she’ll get what she always wanted. His fearlessness with Connie; figuring out what the company will do - it was his idea to get them fired; the only thing that made me hate him was the macho hypocrisy, calling Betty a whore.

BETTY can’t be bullied any more; she has an answer for everything Don says - I’m not the one who destroyed this family - I’ve never been enough. As far as what she now knows about him, I don’t believe she is affected by the fact that he came from a poor background; just the lies.

BERT is so tough! For instance, the way he gets Harry to come with them.

@anonymous 1:11am (& everyone), Don talking to Peggy that he knew she would understand how things change people: “People want to buy things - People like you and me” ... “Something happened - Something terrible” (the Kennedy assassination, the pregnancy) ... ”Nobody understands that - but you do - and that’s very valuable.” So is that what makes her a good copywriter in the advertising industry? Are people who write ad copy social scientists? This dialogue has me a little confused.

Ending is somewhat satisfying, not a cliffhanger. It just shows the survivors in their temporary outpost - sharing sandwiches that Trudy brought. Bless her heart! It’s really great to see the whole cast in the most democratic moment in three years, there was a real warmth, even peacefulness in the last scene.

Ordinarily it takes a couple of hours to see a film, a couple of weeks to read a book. But for a work of art to take YEARS OF YOUR LIFE, to go alongside the events of your life? That’s spooky.

Season 3 literally followed the calendar in our time - in the fall. Any thoughts on how much time will pass, and what will have happened offcamera, when Season 4 starts?

Funniest line for me was when clueless Harry after being told by Cooper that they want him to come along and be the new head of "Media" asks "Are You Kidding" and Roger quips "Yes, yes we are Happy Birthday"
I would have love to see Bert Cooper wrestle Harry into the storeroom to lock him in if had come to that.

Will Don's stash be exposed?

Hey Hobo!

Wasn't it great to see Joan taking charge again...this time amongst a newly-unified, excited group.

Her delivery of the line "If you have client meetings take them elsewhere...I don't want to see them in the lobby or the bar..." was so well-played. (Reminded me of a parent saying to the kids: "If you're going to rough-house take it outside..don't bring it around me").

Oh happy day!! My dream of a "revolution" came true and the Brits were sacked. Superb finale!
I loved all the favorites getting together in the hotel room....especially Joan. Perfect. And Trudy bringing lunch...she is too adorable.

Don and Betty: the marriage was in the dumper long ago...might as well get it over with, except I feel soooo sorry for the kids. Thank goodness they have Carla is all I can say.(and is it vaguely important that Betty doesn't really love Henry...IMO, of course)

Loved Pryce finally giving StJohn the verbal finger : "Happy Christmas".

Finally, that Dick wasn't responsible for his dad's death....the horse did it (ha ha).

The good old days! Every time I get a half of dozen or more people in a hotel room I always get in trouble by the management.

Wait till Lane Price's wife finds out that they are not going back to London.

So what is the signifcance of the flashback?

A new beginning? Nobody owns me?

Hey Deep long time no see. I was wondering about the cash too. Couldn't Don use it to get an actual office space for S/C/D/P. Maybe there is a stategy to being in a hotel, but not for long.
I did enjoy seeing all the essential characters in the throes of excitement, that people share when starting a new project. When the show resumes I wonder how this will impact Duck's plans both in buisness and in bed with Peggy. I also hope that Sal is not brought back, because of the Lucky Strike conflict. As their centerpiece account they can not be gambled with over an Art Director. Seeing Lois not fired still has me steamed. Bringing Sal back will not make me happy. In addition, What a jerk Conrad Hiltopn developed into as the season progressed. I hope in real life his great named is tarnished by some slutty and painfully stupid Grandchildren.

Wait until Lane Price's wife finds out that they are not going back to London. The makings of another marital bed of woe, I should think.

What about Alice Cooper! :)))

DON IS BACK!

JOAN IS BACK, literally and as always figuratively

Peggy gets her status with Don ironed out... and she's not getting the coffee metaphorically or any other wasy either from now on!!!

SO realistic how the marriage went, the kids now left to try and imagine their lives - suddenly in a dissolve - that was and never will be again... tougher for Sally...

The start up from the hotel room is just priceless... Trudy getting the food... offering, "isn't this exciting!"
That was great...

And the trollop line from Burt to Roger, as mentioned earlier, was a true classic...

P

I'm so excited about the A team that Don has put together. It's so funny how Pete is finally getting the validation from Don that he always craved, and it was always Obvious that Peggy and Don were both connected, "I assumed you were an extension of me" Don said to Peggy, and he's finally giving her the respect that she craved from him. And lets not forget Joan, the glue thats gonna keep that office together. I guess her soldier boy is gonna have a hard time convincing her now. I'm glad that MM was only playing possum the last few episodes. I thought the show was falling apart and that the writers were getting desperate and jumped the shark when the dumb ass Brit got his foot cut off in the office by the John Deere tractor. NOT!!! They are back and with a vengeance. Way to go MM. Some great stuff for next year will this scenario create. I'm sure it will create new villians out of some of the old cadre from Sterling Cooper that will remain with the new takeover, Like Cosgrove and Kinsey, and hopefully Sal will wind up with Don and company.

@Anonymous and Goodstuff-- I watched the scene with Don and Peggy again, and I see exactly what you mean now. Good for you! Thanks for enlightening me, because it's just exactly what Don would do, relate it to something in his personal life, and then connect it to hers in a way she could recognize and feel. Like the Kodak Carousel pitch.

@MJinGA-- sorry! I wasn't referring to you. I always forget how so many folks just drop in on MM night to ask the same thing over and over because they either don't get how the posting works or just don't want to bother to read back a bit. Didn't mean to snap, but it's tough enough getting on after the airing without redundant posts.

I was asked for my e-mail by AMC tonight. That's new and weird. Anyone else?

I'm hoping the new season will start with Don and the kids spending some comfortable time together, and Suzanne in the picture somewhere. Do you think his being divorced would make any difference to how she feels about him? Would he tell her about his Whitman past?

What kind of mother heads to Reno for 6 weeks just before Christmas and leaves her kids with the housekeeper? Betty is and always will be a narcissistic bitch. Hope circumstances force her to come crawling back to Don.

To Conrad lovers: You can have him!
What a freaking lame, pompous, BORING holier-than-thou character. Total waste of all space. Glad to see Don finally tell him off. Notice when Conny said maybe they'd hook up again down the road, Don did not affirm. F that!

To the Betty haters: Don yells at her - w/her kids there in her home - calls her a 'whore!'
When if anyone is a whore it's him.
Why should she have to put up w/that shit?
He should have apologized for saying that, at some point at least.
But that's how it is - a woman spreads her wings, she's a whore - a man does it, he's just a man.
That's how it was then, and to a large extent, that's how it is today.
Women are 'sluts,' while guys get to write to books, bragging about how many 'sluts' they bagged.
And it's high-fives from guys all around.
And BTW, I'm a guy.
I say, it's a double standard. And it's BS.

That being said...
- Maybe Don will become more humane and human than he-man now, will be a better father, and nicer to 'Betts,' and who knows? Maybe now that Betty is free, maybe she will reevaluate and give him another chance.
- Or maybe Betty will get together with another MM character, and really piss off Don, and then let's have more fireworks fly!
- Otherwise, it's bye-bye Betty as a major character.
*MUAH*

It's weird. Betty looks like history, and meanwhile January will be hosting SNL next week. Maybe Jans will be spreading her wings, too.

It was great seeing Joan back.
And Peggy.
Peggy was finally free so what the hell, she could and did stand up to Don and tell him off.
Then just like he did with Pete, Don gave his best sales pitch, his best ad campaign and Pegs bought it.
It was the best scene.

Now that there is a brand new playing field set up for Mad Men next season, the most interesting question is when do we next drop in to see what condition it's in? Is it 1964 when the Beatles hit New York, or do we jump ahead a few years to say 1967, when bombs are dropping in Nam and the band drops Pepper on the world, and the colors man, the colors...

@patsycline: We posted within minutes of each other, and both picked the same quote..."Because you're good..." I agree that was an extremely riviting scene, and excllent acting from Jon Hamm--in fact he outdid himself in every scene in the episode. Quite a performance.

I'm not sure, however, that I see a silver lining for Betty and Henry Francis. Something about the way they were sitting, mute, almost disinterested as the plane headed for Reno. I couldn't tell whether Henry was reading, or asleep...but he wasn't absorbed in Betty, that's for sure. And I thought she looked rather distracted, maybe a little apprehensive or pensive? There was nothing of joy or excitment that I saw between them in that moment. It made me wonder how this rather impetuous relationship is going to fare, given the initial hurdle of living together for 6 weeks in some motel in Reno with a 6-month-old-baby. Nuh-uh. Doesn't sound like anthing I'd put money on.

Au contraire, I'd lay odds that in 3 weeks Betty's going to be re-thinking her whole "exit" from Don.

Did anybody wonder if Henry Francis might be in line to be "on the ticket" as a Rockefeller potential vice-president candidate? Thought of that when Henry said to the lawyer something like: "We don't need another scandal on the ticket."

To Conrad lovers: You can have him!
What a freaking lame, pompous, BORING holier-than-thou character. Total waste of all space. Glad to see Don finally tell him off. Notice when Conny said maybe they'd hook up again down the road, Don did not affirm. F that!

To the Betty haters: Don yells at her - w/her kids there in her home - calls her a 'whore!'
When if anyone is a whore it's him.
Why should she have to put up w/that shit?
He should have apologized for saying that, at some point at least.
But that's how it is - a woman spreads her wings, she's a whore - a man does it, he's just a man.
That's how it was then, and to a large extent, that's how it is today.
Women are 'sluts,' while guys get to write to books, bragging about how many 'sluts' they bagged.
And it's high-fives from guys all around.
And BTW, I'm a guy.
I say, it's a double standard. And it's BS.

That being said...
- Maybe Don will become more humane and human than he-man now, will be a better father, and nicer to 'Betts,' and who knows?
Maybe now that Betty is free, maybe she will reevaluate and give him another chance.
- Or maybe Betty will get together with another MM character, and really piss off Don, and then let's have more fireworks fly!
- Otherwise, it's bye-bye Betty as a major character.
*MUAH*

It's weird. Betty looks like history, and meanwhile January will be hosting SNL next week. Maybe Jans will be spreading her wings, too.

It was great seeing Joan back.
And Peggy.
Peggy was finally free so what the hell, she could and did stand up to Don and tell him off.
Then just like he did with Pete, Don gave his best sales pitch, his best ad campaign and Pegs bought it.
It was the best scene.

Now that there is a brand new playing field set up for Mad Men next season, the most interesting question is when do we next drop in to see what condition it's in? Is it 1964 when the Beatles hit New York, or do we jump ahead a few years to say 1967, when bombs are dropping in Nam and the band drops Pepper on the world, and the colors man, the colors...

(I'm having trouble getting my comment posted, so here goes again...)

To Conrad lovers: You can have him!
What a freaking lame, pompous, BORING holier-than-thou character. Total waste of all space. Glad to see Don finally tell him off. Notice when Conny said maybe they'd hook up again down the road, Don did not affirm. F that!

To the Betty haters: Don yells at her - w/her kids there in her home - calls her a 'whore!'
When if anyone is a whore it's him.
Why should she have to put up w/that shit?
He should have apologized for saying that, at some point at least.
But that's how it is - a woman spreads her wings, she's a whore - a man does it, he's just a man.
That's how it was then, and to a large extent, that's how it is today.
Women are 'sluts,' while guys get to write to books, bragging about how many 'sluts' they bagged.
And it's high-fives from guys all around.
And BTW, I'm a guy.
I say, it's a double standard. And it's BS.

That being said...
- Maybe Don will become more humane and human than he-man now, will be a better father, and nicer to 'Betts,' and who knows?
Maybe now that Betty is free, maybe she will reevaluate and give him another chance.
- Or maybe Betty will get together with another MM character, and really piss off Don, and then let's have more fireworks fly!
- Otherwise, it's bye-bye Betty as a major character.
*MUAH*

It's weird. Betty looks like history, and meanwhile January will be hosting SNL next week. Maybe Jans will be spreading her wings, too.

It was great seeing Joan back.
And Peggy.
Peggy was finally free so what the hell, she could and did stand up to Don and tell him off.
Then just like he did with Pete, Don gave his best sales pitch, his best ad campaign and Pegs bought it.
It was the best scene.

Now that there is a brand new playing field set up for Mad Men next season, the most interesting question is when do we next drop in to see what condition it's in? Is it 1964 when the Beatles hit New York, or do we jump ahead a few years to say 1967, when bombs are dropping in Nam and the band drops Pepper on the world, and the colors man, the colors...

I thought the argument in the bedroom between Don and Betty was quite sexually charged. For a moment there, in the heat of it, I thought he might force himself on her. Don always tried to keep Betty in the Madonna/mother role (remember his fuss when she wanted to wear the sexy bathing suit in public?). But limiting her in that way also made him become bored with her. The women he could categorize as whorish were the ones who excited him, so the fact that he was calling Betty a "Whore" had significance beyond just an insult to throw at her. He'll probably become obsessed with her now and want her more than he ever did when she was home waiting for him every night.

Joan and Don next season with that development frustrating the cyclic Don-Roger on and off again friendship???

But ultimately, Don and Peggy are destined to end up together, as I said - on this board - season one episode 4!

"I think of you as an extension of myself," sayeth Don tonight.

And let's not forget the classic cliche of eternal love, " You have become a part of me!"

Shipper foreshadowing! Yep...

P

@Fifty-two Hi 52 I am jealous of your Lily e-mail. Maybe you won something. Hope so. Nice to see a few familiar faces here.
@Blueknife If Sal is brought back it should be by McCain-Erickson not the new S/C/D/P. They can't risk the Lucky Strike account more than ever. Just on a credibility standpoint I don't want Sal with the new co.
@fixxin I agree with you about Betty as a mother, however I think the whole divorce subject should have been withheld by Don and Betty until at least mid January so as not to tarnish the holiday season for those kids forever. I mean the house was decorated and Christmas music was playing, Christmas is in two weeks. Christmas will be bittersweet at best for these kids for a long while.

I've just watched the season finale, read all the comments and only wanted to add that there was a great feeling of liberation, sort of a collective sigh at the end of this season which has to stem from the fact that the Don Draper character has been largely unmasked. There's always a feeling of dread that his past or his lies will surface and undermine all he's tried so hard to create, or that somehow that conflict with who is really is and who he's trying so hard to be have led to his impulsive, often destructive behavior. Lots of key people know now, Betty, Pete, Cooper. Were Roger to know, perhaps he already does, I think he wouldn't care. Joan is the model of discretion and wouldn't care. Don can finally start being himself and hopefully we'll see where that takes him.

It's a powerful moment when he tells Betty that "God knows" their kids would be better off with him. When's the last time we saw her share anything intimate with those children? This thing with Henry Francis has happened very quickly and although he seems to represent every waspish aspect of Betty's ideal, it rings a bit false.

I hope the teacher is a done deal as well. Season 4 gets to take off from this great cliffhanger finale.

@fifty-two hi 52 good to see a few familiar faces still here. I agree with@fixxin above about Betty being a poor mother, but both Don and Betty could have withheld the separation announcement until a few weeks after the holidays. I mean there was Christmas music playing and Yuletide decorations all over the house. I think they have stolen nChristmas from these kids in some ways.

patsycline: there are partners whose names are not a part of the title. and notice they did tell him that the title and the name on the wall would have to be earned.

JulieLondon: great point about Lane's wife! LOL!!! maybe she will return w/out him... i'm not sure what a British wife would do back then.

hobocode52: i realize your thoughts about Conrad, but if you really think about it, he was doing Don a favor. his intentions were not to upset Don -it was about business that required him to take his acct away. i think Don will realize it later that he jumped the gun when going off on Conrad...

Wow, a great episode and perfect season closer, I don't know why I was surprised Bets finally pulled the trigger on the divorce and especially to go to the attorneys office with a guy that she has been in the same room with 4 times and kissed once. It has obviously all been covered here tonight but I do want to point out one thing and that is that Kiernan Shipka is just an amazing little actress as Sally Draper. How could we not just cringe at what we see her go through and think of how this will affect her (character) at that age. She is a treasure.

Okay I have waited all season to make this rant towards AMC. Lets all complain repeatedly between now and Season 4 for them NOT to jack up the volume of the commercials. I have surround-sound and I almost get knocked out of the chair when those commercials come on. Please tell me I'm not the only one.

@anonymous of nov9 1:21 am I dont know if you are same anonymous as 10:23 a couple of nights ago. I am guessing yes in this post-anonamalyptic world. anyway as far as the 1:21 post "Right On" and long long overdue.

> JulieLondon I'd have to agree about the bedroom scene, it was getting pretty sexually charged there and when I read your post I remembered that when Don started man-handling Betty, Betty gave Don this weird look and I kind of mumbled, "God, I think she likes it".. which of course caused my wife to give me a weird look..

Hello all!

I just made myself a profile, and this is my first post! Allow me to introduce myself...

I've been a fan of Mad Men since day one, but only discovered this forum part way through season 3. I've truly enjoyed reading the comments on various episodes. There are a lot of clever viewers posting here, which pleases me as I feel I'm in good company!

I was born in '66, so am a bit behind the times, but I still remember some of the things that pop up...much of the decor and attitudes were prevalent in my life growing up (eg. the spoon collection on the Draper's kitchen wall---I had one of those! In fact, I think it is still sitting in a box my parent's basement!) I was also raised Catholic, so I love Peggy's scenes and really relate to her--she's one of my favourite characters.

My father was a businessman and shares many of Don's characteristics; emotionally closed-off, humble background, etc. I especially loved one scene where the Draper's kids cousins were sleeping over and Don yelled out the door, "Enough!" (not a direct quote, it was something like that, though...) That was my dad right there, man! Haha. Don also shares some commonalities with my ex-bf...again, emotionally shut down, mysterious background, gruff at times, etc. Don is also one of my favourite characters, naturally!

Personally, my own background is in Art, so I adore the sets, costumes, colours, lighting, ie: everything visual about the show. I love when I see comments from other viewers in this forum about these things. Please don't stop!

I've always felt that watching Mad Men is like reading a good book. All of the layers, hidden/dual meanings, foreshadowing, etc. I enjoy going back to older episodes and revisiting, just as I would re-read passages from a well-loved novel. I always discover something new that I missed before...

Anyway, I'm so very sad that tonight was the finale! But it was a goodie, wasn't it? I got so excited when they came up with the whole "defection" idea. And then the recruitment...I was like, omg who are they gonna grab next? Loved the whole hotel scene, all the little upstarts working in a tiny makeshift space and then Trudy showing up with sandwiches (she's a trooper, isn't she?) I'm hoping they are going to ask Sal back to run the art department. I dig Sal and was super bummed when he got sacked. I'd love to see that happen. Please bring back Sal!

I think I saw someone ask, when does season 4 begin? I'm sorry, I didn't see if anyone answered, but I really wanna know! My apologies, I don't have time to read all 250+ posts, but I do skim them and read any that catch my eye. I know some people get uppity when people repeat things that have already been said---sorry, but it takes hours to read through the entire thread and I just can't. Forgive me.

I've noticed that some people were a little unhappy with season 3, but I really enjoyed it. Sure, some episodes were a bit slow (I watch online, and sometimes I fall asleep and have to watch again later! haha), but I think that well, being pedantic was necessary to move the plot along...and it all seems even more obvious after tonight's show. It seems obvious to me now! I had a great chat with my mom about the JFK shooting episode, she remembers where she was clear as a bell--washing the kitchen floor while my older brother napped. She didn't have the tv on (she said, "we never had the tv on in the daytime back then!) but someone called her. I'm Canadian, so the events in the States mean something different to me, but affect me nonetheless. One scene that really struck home with me was when Grandpa Gene died, and Sally was watching tv in her ballerina outfit. There was a monk (in Vietnam, I presume) who set himself on fire (in protest). I remember the exact same thing, as a child. I was maybe 7 years old, so that would have been in the early 70's. I saw a monk set himself on fire on the news. It's clear in my memory, and had a huge impact on how I view the world.

I'm so excited to see how season 4 will play out. The 60's are just getting going!

Well, I've rambled on long enough. What are we all gonna do 'til next season?

P.S. Greg--I love reading what you have to say. Your opinions often echo mine.

Oh man.

Don saying to Betty, "You're a whore, you know that"? Right then, the baby cries. Don himself is the baby of a whore.

@Freddie Rumson, who watches commercials. not me. i always DVR it and skip threw em. Uh-oh maybe I shouldn't have said that here.
Hope they bring your avatars image back to the new co. I am sure they can get Freddie if he is not dead already. I also agree with you about little Kiernan. So much of the season was shown threw her eyes and it all rang so true. Credit should be shared with this great little actor and the writers who gave her such rich character development and lines this season.
@JulieLondon Lane's wife is a prudish prune who should be kept around as a character only if MW can come up with new ways to torment her.

Awesome episode. My favorite scene, though, was by far Powell's phone call to Pryce. Nobody's really noticed through his British veneer, but Pryce has taken a lot of crap lately. He has a high maintenance wife, to say the least. He would have been transported on a whim to Bombay, hardly a posh arrangement in 1963, if not for lawnmower mutilation. He had to make some very uncomfortable, extreme short-term decisions as PPL looked to sell the firm (and as it turns out, itself).

He got it all back with that conversation though, a dream for any worker under an oppressive boss. Screw them, literally out of millions of pounds. Happy Christmas, cheerio.

Also, I'm guessing Campbell didn't get all those clients to come on board, and he didn't get the prize at the end of the tunnel, a name partner.

I'm not seeing Sal coming back either. They'll probably hire somebody completely different to do artwork/TV direction, perhaps that guy Draper was turned down to hire. American Tobacco is 2/3 of their business and there's no way they do anything that could ever, possibly endanger that account. Sal's probably written out of the show.

Awesome episode. My favorite scene, though, was by far Powell's phone call to Pryce. Nobody's really noticed through his British veneer, but Pryce has taken a lot of crap lately. He has a high maintenance wife, to say the least. He would have been transported on a whim to Bombay, hardly a posh arrangement in 1963, if not for lawnmower mutilation. He had to make some very uncomfortable, extreme short-term decisions as PPL looked to sell the firm (and as it turns out, itself).

He got it all back with that conversation though, a dream for any worker under an oppressive boss. Screw them, literally out of millions of pounds. Happy Christmas, cheerio.

Also, I'm guessing Campbell didn't get all those clients to come on board, and he didn't get the prize at the end of the tunnel, a name partner.

I'm not seeing Sal coming back either. They'll probably hire somebody completely different to do artwork/TV direction, perhaps that guy Draper was turned down to hire. American Tobacco is 2/3 of their business and there's no way they do anything that could ever, possibly endanger that account. Sal's probably written out of the show.

This episode was definitely redemptive for all the BS this season unrelated to the business. This is why I watch this show and love it so much.

Still not understanding the Betty-Henry axis. Henry definitely sounds sincere in his intentions towards Betty, and they have not just jumped into bed together, which sounds the plausible route to Betty's heart. But does Henry Francis really know what he's getting into? What a nightmare Betty will be!

Can't believe that Don didn't stay in the house knowing Betty will be living in Reno for 6 weeks to establish legal residency for the divorce to be finalized. I loved Henry consulting Rocky's divorce lawyer on how to go about it. Right to the source! What a scumbag...

Don appeared to be genuinely happy at the closing of the first day of business at SCDP. Lane called his morning "very productive," because he finally told the bastards off. I loved the summary assignment he gave to Hooker, less than a minute after Hooker set up the call from London: "I've been sacked. Please have my things and office stored at this address." And he walks out. Terrific!

"Four men shot their own legs off..." At least Lois had nothing to do with it...

@Greg: Great commentary as always, brother.

hobocode52@3:10AM: Funny remark about CH's progeny. I thought he came off somewhat smarmy also; or at least a little drama queenish (I harken back to his odd-hours phone calls, plus the "Can you come-over" entreaty (middle of night), and then his hissy-fit because he didn't get the Moon. (Makes me wonder which Moon he wanted). After whinning to Don that night about how nobody (but Don) understands him, he then narcisstically says to Don in the "kiss off scene" : "I got everything I have on my own..." (that's why I dont truck whinners). Well hhuhh! It all made me think he's the quintessential user. Uses people then tosses them aside. And hey, it's business, Don. Just business. You could almost see Don processing that whole life lesson just in those few seconds. I think Don's exit from CH's room was an excellent bit of non-verbal, physical acting. His subtle, but noticeable gaze on some of the ornate furnishings as he left the room somehow managed to convey a scornful putdown of Connie -- almost like a "kill with a look" kind of thing -- which he couldn't do to Connie, so he did it to his furnishings. (Or maybe I'm just crazy. I'd like to know if anyone else read that into it).

Re. the significance of the "price of wheat" flashback...there's got to be some correlation there having to do with Mr. Whitman's readily throwing out the "co-operative agreement" when it didn't suit him, and CH (another father figure for Don) tossing Don aside when Don no longer suited him. .

Also, Don had to be thinking of how his Dad's death came right upon his decision to strike out for Chicago to make his own deal there-- cut back to Don and SC striking out on their own. Scary stuff.

Hiya Hobo! I know you'll scoff, but I really DID like Lane Pryce early on and if I could find my post from way back, it would say I thought he seemed like a decent enough chap. Really!

I love what you said about the Draper kids and how they will think about Christmas. Was it necessary to lie to them that way? It reminded me of the song "D-I-V-O-R-C-E" and how Tammy sings about how they can't say the word in front of the kids. By the way, I couldn't sign on the other night when you were talking about Delaney and Bonnie, but I love the way Patty Loveless covered "I've Got a Never-ending Love for You" a few years ago. Great stuff, highly recommend it.

Oh yeah, Lily didn't email me-- they just demanded my email when I tried to sign on tonight. Never did before. What's that about?

My only misgiving about this episode is that it appears Ken Cosgrove is history and I will never know if my prediction that he will be revealed as a self loathing, deeply closeted gay man would be revealed in Season 4. But maybe we will see Sal and Ken bump into each other in an underground nightclub in a future cameo.

@hobocode52, I too miss Freddie but the reason I took his name is that I unfortunately look alot like Freddie. But I have yet to piss my pants..- at the office

Don't think Betty's a whore?

Don knows Betty married him for a fur coat. He also knows that it wasn't his affair with Bobbie that killed their chances at reconciliation-- it was her upper class scorn for his reduced status that was the deal-breaker. He's been gradually accepting that she is not the loving mother he envisioned for his kids. She certainly looked the part of a whore in Rome, I thought-- sitting there listening to the smut those men were throwing at her, all alone in a public square at night. She's had a whore fascination since she learned an interesting little fact... that fashion models can turn very expensive tricks. It got her thinking, and since she's always been able to get whatever she wanted from men without doing much of anything except parading her body and face, she decided to trade in her dowdy car for a brand new model. Since when did it matter if she really knew or loved the guy?

Why Pete and not Cosgrove? Don's always hated Pete.

Anyway, considering how many enemies Don's made ,or at least practically cultivated, it's shocking that he was able to heal all the wounds.

@ddesq: "...at least Lois had nothing to do with it!" :) !

Did you ever figure out who Mona's date at the wedding might have been? I was curious as to whether that might have been a character drawn from real life, because they bothered to give some details...like Roger's saying he was half-a-million(?) poorer the day after JFK's assasination. I think you were the one who pointed that out, so I'm just repeating what I thought was a interesting point.

pls tell me your thoughts about my comments. i feel left out...

@fifty-two No scoffing at you here. you were on board the Pryce train early. I remember. Check out Comin Home and Country Life also by D&B
I think they could have waited till after the holidays to drop that bomb on those loveable mostly clueless kids. Loved the realism of Sally's anger. That scene hit to close to home for me as a divorced parent who had to make a similar speech, with no support from idiot ex who started the proceedings.Everyone survived and I wound up much happier with the kids. Still that is a tough conversation on all parties involved.

Some people on this forum have criticized January Jones' acting as wooden, but I think she's very subtle .. and true to Betty's repressed character. If you happen to watch a rerun of the finale, watch her face when Don telephones from the hotel to tell her that he is not going to fight her.

It's as fast as a flicker ... but it's the way she knits her brow. It reveals disappointment. Because in actual fact, she wanted Don to fight her. It's still all about Betty trying to get Don's attention, even if it has to be in a bad way, and he refusing to give it to her.

Funny, Don had no problem turning around the threatened defection of Peggy and Pete. He quickly figured out what they wanted to hear from him and he delivered it. But he can't seem to do this for Betty. Maybe because his emotions are in the way.

@Julie-- I think you're right about her look of disappointment, but I think she really wanted to unload the kids on Don, but was putting up a front because nice women don't ditch their children. Remember how the family lawyer told her she'd lose them in a divorce? I don't think that struck her as such a bad deal. Don's got her right where he wants her. She won't get a nickel and he'll end up finding a nicer Mommy for poor Sally and Bobby. Maybe we won't have to hear Betty saying "go upstairs, go watch TV, go play" ever again!

@Jacklq-- I agree about Don burning the Hilton bridge prematurely. Funny how Sterling and Cooper didn't question him about why he wasn't bringing Connie along. I see Roger asking Don to make it all better somewhere down the road, like with the Mencken account.

Don's memories of his father recalled how Archie wouldn't have been killed if he'd stuck to his guns about striking his own deal for the wheat. It seemed to steel Don for the battle ahead, not letting himself be bullied into a deal he couldn't live with, whether at work or at home.

Well . . . I'm done with predictions. I got one of them right (Don founding his own adv. agency, with the help of Joan). I thought they'd call Sal for the keys to the art dept. But (darn it!) I loved seeing Don kick the door down!! Wouldn't you?

Aren't you glad that Don and Roger are friends again? They're like the dynamic duo / partners in crime, aren't they? And thank god for Joan!!! I know you've all been raving about her and I don't think I've contributed my accolades. She is an actress of rare talent. Did you see how suavely she handled Don's order (yes, alas, he ordered and didn't ask) of finding him an apartment. As usual, Joan takes in the entire situation in an instant. "Of course, sorry about that!" (or something like that) Exactly! Concise, right on the mark, says it all in a half-dozen words! Brilliant!

Greg--we're on the same wavelength entirely. Indeed, the words Don used to persuade Peggy seemed as though they should have been for Betty. But this was a pitch, I guess. Did he mean what he said? Does it matter? At the end of last season, he pitched Betty about taking him back. It worked. He could have pitched her again, and it might have worked. He's pretty good at, after all. He chose not to, this time. I actually thought that moment would come in that last phone call. I saw it coming, especially after his envious look at Pete and Trudy's relationship. But no. He decided to make amends for behaving like his father the night before (drunk, threatening) and let her go. Maybe he realized that he doesn't feel for Betty what Pete feels for Trudy.

I wonder, though? Are Don and Betty Done done (sure looks like it) or just done until next season. I believe that next season will start after the divorce. Anybody?

Another thing. That final shot of the the new Sterling/Cooper/Draper/Pryce Adv. Agency--dramaturgically, it functioned like a curtain call, no? They were this season's best actors, in my view. I think it was also an introduction of next season's central cast of characters. I wonder if MW left the ending kind of vague until toward the end of shooting, just to see whom he'd like to hang on to. Thoughts?

Time heals all wounds
Time wounds all heals
The flash back gave Don the little bit of insight,he needed to get through this episode.
Now that Don is Dick he's alright with it and that makes him a different Don than we've seen before. Everything he says and does isn't BS. The fact that Betty isn't alright with it makes her worthless to him.
Peggy is Don' protege nothing more. "People buy things,people like you and me..." Don was telling her he felt her pain. He's tried telling her before that that is uniquie,and that makes good copy. I think he has always felt there is something special between them, more than even she knows. He realized she needed to hear him tell her this and to show her respect.He was so comfortable with her at her messy little apartment.Great scene.
Didn't Sal take everything from the art department he did for SC?
Roger telling Bert ,"You leave your shoes outside the door here they'll shine them for you ." ,was great.
Joan wearing her pen necklace again.
Media gets the bedroom because the TV is in there.Right on.
Don and Roger talking about ever being in an office like this again, another honest scene of Don being humble.
Don looking up as Betty flies over head with a sleeping old man next to her. I'm so mad at her.
Don is in a very good place with himself right now.As is the office of Sterling,Cooper,Draper,Price.The energy was felt. Love seeing everyone together for the cause !
I swear Charles Shaughnessy (as Mr. Sheffield) fired Nanny Fine a few times with the same lines he said to Price.

I love Joan.

I just loved the last episode.Yes,we all were very down as a NATION AFTER JFK DIED ,BUT WE GOT ON WITH LIFE,JUST LIKE THE SHOW.........JUST LIKE TODAY.I SAY GREAT TIME FOR OPTIMISTS AND I CAN'T WAIT FOR THE NEXT SEASON. I WOULD LOVE TO PURCHASE THE LAST SONG,I HAD NEVER HEARD IT BEFORE.......HOPE TO READ ALL THE BLOGS NEXT EPOSODE,I SURE LEARNED A LOT FROM YOU CRAZY BLOOGERS.......THANKS

Hi fellow Maddicts!

I read as many posts as possible, please excuse any repeats.

I am sorry to see another Season end!

Things I noticed...

Don sleeping in "Gene" room in opening scene, Betts must have kicked him out of their bedroom.
Then Sally sleeping in there? I thought that room freaked her out? (she said so during the family divorce talk scene)
And, during this scene Betty saying she and the kids would be staying in the house? Henry needs to be in Albany, unless he is going to commute.

Does Betty look like she has a half a clue as to what she has done? That closing scene of her on the plane with the baby and Henry?
She looks miserable, as usual, Henry is asleep.
They don't even know each other, and they are going to Reno for 6 weeks?
Don't get me going about her leaving Sally and Bobby home at Christmas time!!
Betty is even more whacked then I previously thought! I think she will regret this divorce, and it will be too late when she realizes it.

I know Don has been a cheating bastard, but, he was right when he told Betty he gave her everything she wanted. She wanted the material things. Right from the beginning of their relationship he wooed her with a fur coat.

Hilton gave Don one last big gift. He did it by pulling out his account, and his speech about being a "self made man", I believe he lit a fire under Don.

The famous Campbell "chip and dip"! Too funny! Pete did say they received 2.

I also loved the scene when the new SC crew were leaving the office for the last time, and Pete is carrying his precious shot gun!

I was thrilled when Roger said he knew who to call to help the SCDP crew find what they needed...I knew it would be Joan! And as usual, Joan didn't miss a beat, and knew exactly what to do!

Pryce was pryceless!!!

Before I go on too long...I hope Sal, Paul, and Ken are asked to join the new SCDP. Oh, Lois and Freddy too...we need the comic relief!

Bye for now...

Anonymous - Am I the only one who noticed that Peggy is PREGNANT!!!???
The swollen face just like Season1. This gets Duck back into the story.

Duck or Fred Arminson?

Anonymous101 - OK, what does Pryce do? Why was he made partner??

He'll do what he did before: Run the finances, a.k.a. CFO and Joan can be office manager or COO.

The question I have will be Pete & Peggy's titles as Roger may be Head of Account and Don will still be Head of Creative. Yes, they are both on the fast track to head those departments, but seems they have too many chiefs and not enough Indians at STD&P. While Trudy may continue to pitch in and help, I don't see Jane getting back into the business, though it would be good for her.

I thought there was a distinct Tony-Carmella vibe in the Don-Betty bedroom confronttion. Especially in his charge that Betty was getting what she wanted and didn't particularly care how he got it for her.

hi fellow maddicz!
I'm a bit shocked by this ep.
1st. Is this all about business? Loyalty changes with benefits? Then how the heck could i know who to trust?

2nd. can't believe betz really left don. Neither that henry really promised to provide her+ 3 kids. (how old is he btw? having an adult daughter?)

3rd. i wonder what don would say when he finds out peggy's been sleeping with duck.. (still can't accept that.... personally..)

hi fellow maddicz!
I'm a bit shocked by this ep.
1st. Is this all about business? Loyalty changes with benefits? Then how the heck could i know who to trust?

2nd. can't believe betz really left don. Neither that henry really promised to provide her+ 3 kids. (how old is he btw? having an adult daughter?)

3rd. i wonder what don would say when he finds out peggy's been sleeping with duck.. (still can't accept that.... personally..)

wait.. how come i can't submit?

Season 3 of Mad Men has been accused of straying from the sociological themes of the first two seasons and even deteriorating into a soap opera. For a while I was unsure about this myself. But after the last few episodes I’m convinced that though the writers may have been experimenting a bit with themes with more “commercial” appeal, they eventually redeemed themselves by returning to the insightful level of dialogue that makes this show the most intelligent drama on television.

Witness the conversation Don has with Peggy in her apartment in this last episode. This is great writing not only because it tells us something vitally important about the characters and their relationship, but engages us in a seldom encountered, nuanced view of the world of advertising that, let’s face it, was what attracted viewers to this remarkable series in the first place.

Consider that the United States is a young country still evolving as a work in progress. Each generation contributes its own unique character to our country’s biography just as rings tell us something about each stage in the development of a tree. Now when encountered in movies and plays, the particular “ring” dramatized in Mad Men, the golden age of advertising, usually receives either a satirical or farcical treatment. Or it's portrayed as a commercial whirlpool were the good are destroyed or from which they must free themselves to be happy. Writers know that, to most viewers, advertising executives occupy the same ring in Hell as politicians.

But MM treats advertising as part of the heart beat of this country, leaving an indelible mark that, like it or not, has helped define the American psyche ever since the 60’s. In his plea to keep Peggy, we witness the old, inspired Don that we haven’t seen for some time. His few words to her speak volumes about how the times are changing and that the pre-war life people so desperately tried to hold on to in post war America is gone. This transformation is revealed through people’s buying habits, which to Don is a chief weather vein of how humans change. He tells Peggy that her talent is being one of the chosen few who know exactly which way the winds are blowing.

Ironically, it’s a talent Don himself doesn’t possess, but his genius is that he’s able to recognize and inspire it in others. For Don, both Peggy and Pete are the wave of not only the country's future but his own.

The only thing I could think of when seeing Betts & Henry on the plane was WOW those seats are wide!

I too was blown away by the many faces of Don/Jon this episode. Teary-eyed with Peggy, gutted by Roger breaking the news of Betty's "infidelity", storming mad with Betty, and humble to hard-nosed with Pete in their come to Jesus meeting.

I swear Don and Peggy were stifling a laugh during their exchange in her apartment--right after she said "Because you can't work for anyone else."

Also enjoyed seeing Lane Pryce first act like he and his bosses had the upper hand in the initial meeting with DraCoopSter, then realizing he's PPL's lap dog ("Why wasn't I told?" "Didn't seem pertinent!"), then grabs the bull by the horns and negotiates rather than being shipped off to Bombay. Also funny that twice he receives a "What's he doing here?", first from Bert then Pete.

I have to list out some favorite moments:
- Roger to Lane: "Don't act like a stranger. We got tea!"
- Roger to Don: "You gonna read us your will? I want the Cadillac."
- Pete, to Don & Roger: "Don't bother. I have other plans." Trudy, from the other room: "Peter, may I speak to you for a moment?"
- Don: "Joan--what a good idea."
- "F"art department. Then Harry & Pete's faces after Don nonchalantly kicks in the door.
- Roger: "Joanie I can't read your writing", sounding like an old married couple.
- Roger: "I'm tired. Peggy can you get me some coffee." Peggy: "No."
- Don's secretary: "We've been robbed!"
- Lane, after being fired: "Very good! Happy Christmas!" (I know this one's been mentioned umpteen times in this thread but it had me ROLLING!)
- Kinsey finds Peggy's empty office: "Dammit!" (Sucker!)

Roger gets the best lines but Bert is not far behind! I love that old devil.

Season 4 predictions:
- Altercation-o-rama between Don & Henry Francis.
- Roger & Joan rekindle the old flame to some degree. "Accounts gets the bed." Mmhmm.
- Sal and Lucky Strike Jr, um, "bury the hatchet." ;D OK probably not. But I do wish Sal would return. I loved his character and the inclusion of gay issues into the story lines added a cool dimension.
- Don's smoker's cough knocks him down. Is it me or have they shown him on more than one occasion with that nasty cough? Lord knows he drinks enough too. Watching this show on Sunday night with whiskey in the house is dangerous.

ps, this is my first post but I've greatly enjoyed reading these threads, which I sadly only discovered halfway into Season 3. I was already smitten by the show but your collective insights have really brought it to life for me. Thank you!

@patsycline "Also, I did not catch why Pete did not get to be partner."

He's a partner but didn't get his name tacked on. I didn't catch what Don says before his purposeful blink though. Something like "Like it or not that works with you" or "Like that nut who works with you" re: goal / Jai Alai. Anyone??

@hobocode52 "I hope in real life his great named is tarnished by some slutty and painfully stupid Grandchildren."

HA!

Don - I hope he is kept single for a while. That way, the writers might be able to concentrate on the rest of the cast. I am sure we’ll see emotional fall out from his divorce. Don didn’t love Betty (I know lots of fans think he did, but see Jon Hamm’s interview 11/8 on Basket of Kisses blog, he didn’t), but he will see this is a failure and if Henry and Betty get in the same social scene, that will drive him crazy. He’ll also struggle with his relationships with the kids, I do think he actually loves them and it will be interesting to see how he deals with a step father in the picture. Also can’t imagine that he’ll be able to build a strong relationship with baby Gene, which is sad.

Betty - She really grew up this year! Where Don handles his dissatisfaction with lies and deception., Betty was honest. Once she realized that she really didn’t love this man, she was unwilling to stay in a sham of a marriage and actually did something about it! She is one of the strongest characters on the show and I hope her character is brought back for season 4. Would love to see how she handles a marriage to Henry, and I hope that the writers allow the character to remain “grown up” and not revert to little girl from S1.

The kids - assuming that we’ll skip a few years, we’ll probably see different actors. Sally will probably blame Betty for the break up and will definitely be screwed up. Bobby and Gene probably won’t have much of a relationship with dad, since he wasn’t really there for them when he actually lived at the house… Perhaps he’ll finally take Bobby to a Yankees game?

Roger, Pete and Joan - wasted this season. So happy that it appears their roles will be fleshed out again in S4. I did think our few peeks into Joan’s marriage were some of the best scenes in the show.

Sal - this was probably the most poignant sub plot this year. I can’t imagine that he won’t be back in some form next year to continue to explore the experience of being a homosexual in NYC in the 60’s.

Peggy - I actually thought her affair with Duck rang true. Gross, but true. Regarding her future, even though her character is ahead of her time in many ways, I suspect she’ll be obsolete by 1970 (she’s just too similar to Don to get out of the decade intact).

Just a comment about Miss Farrell. Based on interviews with Hamm and Weiner, it seems that she was supposed to be a really good person. Obviously, to many viewers (including me) she came off as at best, creepy. I wonder if this was an issue with the actor or the dialog, or the plot line (Sally’s teacher). One way or another, this is the 1st mistress that didn’t seem to deliver on Weiner’s vision of the role. Midge, Rachel, and Bobbi came across on screen exactly as Weiner described.

It made me mad when Don called Betty a whore. Who is the whore? Don is the one who sleeps around. And to grab her like that was just wrong.

Hopefully, he will be divorced and free to whore around as much as he wants.

The starting of a new ad agency is great and I can't wait to see where it picks up next season.

DID YOU LOSE MY COMMENTS......GREAT SHOW AND COMMENTS-I'LL TRY NEXT SEASON TO GET ON BOARD JOANIEBIRD

By sky on November 9, 2009 1:01 AM

can someone come up with a definitive list of clients for madmen?

Ive got:
John Deere
Seacorp~sp?
lucky strike
heineken
clearsil
pampers
hilton
coke-patio
something about telegraphs
american airlines
aquanet was it?
samosnite
amierican aviation
jai a'lai.
menken department store

what else? successes and fails.. who had what account, its becoming a blur

*********************************************************

They won't get Coke-patio. The Coca-Cola people go with McCann-Erickson. I worked at McCann in the 70's. They had Coca-Cola exclusively. One McCann office was at the corner of North Ave/Ponce De Leon (south) and Peachtree Street, Atlanta. The Coke Building was on North Avenue (north) when you drive through Georgia Tech. We were constantly running back and forth over I-85 (on North Avenue) to deliver this or that.

Good list, though.

The set design of SC and it's modern furniture was so much like Atlanta's McCann - all the secretaries together in one large room. Creative off in an area with sofas, etc. - anything to make it more comfortable to drum up ideas for clients. This was my first job out of college and I was a lowly secretary for the Coke account.

I knew Henry would come in to assist Betty in talking with a divorce attorney, and I also knew the advice she received would be kind that does not make Henry look bad. Yes Don is not going to fight Betty, but Betty is going to leave with just the children, and they will be difficult because they do love their Father. Henry has fell in love with Betty in a similar way that Don has fell in love with Suzanne. It appears that each will get what they think they desire. It was great to see Don and Roger back together again, Sal cant be too far behind and there is hope for Freddy Rumsen. For a moment there I thought Roger and Don were in the club they too Friddy to when he was fired, also the kind of place where my screenname comes from. But most of all, I am excited to have Joan back, I miss her most of all. Maybe another reason Roger is my favorite madman. Bravo MW

Fantastic season. Thank you.
Best line of this (best ever) episode was delivered by Pete: "I'm not really sick."
Why, oh why can't all TV be like this? Superb.

Greg: I still think you're mistaken about what Don said to Peggy to convince her to join SCDP.

To convince Roger, Don had to recognize his value and apologize. To convince Pete, Don had to recognize his value and apologize. By saying, "I'll spend the rest of my life trying to hire you," Don is similarly recognizing Peggy's value and trying to apologize. Why would he treat her differently than anyone else at SC he realizes that he needs?

In fact, I think that Don's telephone call to Betty at the end of the episode makes it four for four: another relationship he is trying to get on the right path even if this means divorce rather than reconciliation (as with the SC staff).

This episode saw Don hit the "reset" button on many important relationships. If Don had threatened Peggy by saying "I won't spend the rest of my life trying to hire you>' that would have been more like the old Don, not the new one we saw emerge in this episode.

@ librarian - I think your use of liberating is a good choice. Not only is Don liberated, from hiding info in his marriage, but also liberated from the kind of contract he had before with SC and feeling trapped. He's "running the show" so to speak. Yes, he decided he does like advertising.

AND now it's the women's turn. Betty made an executive decision. Who knows what will happen with her plans. Joan is valued and called back and these poor men don't know how her part of the office is run without her. Peggy is elevated to an equal among men. So this is 1963. Is the tide turning in 1964 for women to be more aggressive in the workplace or even at home? Is there a subtle movement going on?

@ the prof said:

Maybe he realized that he doesn't feel for Betty what Pete feels for Trudy.
**********************************************************

You got me thinking...maybe Don sees Betty doesn't do/feel for him like Trudy does/feel for Pete.

He sees what a loving, WARM, wife Trudy is. There are women out there who help their husbands.

Great episode last night. Great to see Joan back with Sterling Cooper crew. I'm enjoying watching Betty and Peggy get stronger and more indeoendent.

Love the show.
Ken
KenLovesTV
http://kenlovestv.wordpress.com

@takefive: I never figured out Mona's date. Sorry. No one gave me any leads.

The group watching the show in Murph's media room all thought Don would slap Betty around a little. That's how these situations come down in real life. Instead, Don settled for calling her "whoar" along with some lame method-actor blather about how she's good and everybody else is bad. In any case, we're all delighted to be rid of Betty, hopefully never to return. Now Don can hook up with a real woman. Yeeeeeee Haaaaaw!

To just a lot of people in general on this blog: Don called Betty a whore, not because he is a hypocrite or because it was true, but because Don knew it would hurt her and fracture her Patrician Facade/Sense of Moral Superiority, Don knows her weak spots as well as she knows his. That's why Don calls her " A Main-Line Brat " ( Philadelphia's Main Line suburbs are the epitome of upper-class/upper middle class WASP old money ) right after he asks her who Henry Francis is. It's not that she's leaving him per se, it's that she is leaving him for another Silver Spoon in his mouth WASP Ivy-Leaguer like herself. Clearly Henry must be independently wealthy just like his boss Rockefeller, there would be no other way for him to leave his job in Albany for a month and a half if he was merely a highly educated middle class civil servant, not to mention taking on a new wife and a ready made family of four, plus flying across country to Reno ( Remember commercial air travel was quite expensive for people w/o an expense account until the late 70's-early 80's ).

I have to admit that Conrad Hilton was getting a bit annoying to me as well over the course of the season, but his last conversation with Don was the trigger for everything that happened in the finale, except the divorce of course. He was saying to Don, you are a self-made man like me, why do you want keep playing the role of an organizational worker-bee? Even if you are at the top of the worker bee caste, you are still an expendable asset, why don't you use this info I gave you and do something with it? And that is exactly what Don did, he pushed Cooper, he pushed Roger, and he pushed Pryce, and then he wooed Pete and then Peggy not once, but twice. Don made Sterling, Cooper, Draper, Pryce a reality, and it all stemmed from what Hilton told him in the episode when Guy lost his foot, " You need to set your sights higher Don, " and he did.

Although Betty's decision to marry Henry may seem rash to some people and it is, I think it is consistent with her character development over the course of 3 seasons. Betty is basically a spoiled and pampered rich girl like Roger and Mona's daughter Margaret, the difference being she is far more physically attractive and thus able to get any man she wants ( Such as Don or Henry ) and is therefore very emotionally stunted in her development as an adult. Betty still has the mind of an adolescent and still wants the power over men she had when she was in her teens and early twenties and because she is beautiful she hasn't declined as much with age as other women she knows have ( Such as Francine who seems resigned to the fact that Carleton will cheat on her and that she has no escape. ) she still has power over men, particularly older men like Roger, Duck, and Henry. All the scenes this season with her father make that abundantly clear. It is also why Betty was so angry after coming back from Rome, she knows she still has it, and she knows she can still bend men to her will, but Don is oblivious to chasing her anymore and besides is as attractive to women as she is to men, and therefore she has no leverage over him. Henry would crawl over broken glass to have Betty and is much older than Don and therefore more appreciative of any attention Betty might give him and that is what Betty wants in a husband, plus they are from the same socioeconomic class and therefore speak a common language.

does anyone know if there is going to be a season 4? I sure hope so. I love this show.

I thought the same thing, Peggy did look "bloated"....please not a little Duck in the oven. It was sooooo marvelous to see Joanie back and happy and saving the day! I want Sal and the others back too..... hopefully they will be on board in season 4. Sally and Billy are going to make life a sheer hell for Betts.....they will not accept the divorce and it won't get any better. The kids love/adore/idolize Don, not Betty. Notice neither child went to cry on their mom's lap. Whether she makes it with her politician or not, it won't be easy. Wasn't Pete just a cute piece of heaven with his hair mussed up pretending to be sick? Love Trudy for her support....

I've never posted this, but from the first season it's bothered me immensely to read comments criticizing Betty for being cold and bitchy and a bad mother and wife. While she's far from perfect, I saw her from the beginning as the subject matter of "The Feminine Mystique," women of her era who woke up and discovered that the beautiful house and the children and the material goods they had been taught to define as happiness still left some hole in their lives, esp. if they had previously had some other source of personal satisfaction, like Betty's modeling career.

Betty did not marry Don for a fur coat. He swept her off her feet, with his charm and his handsome face and his awe of her. He pitched himself to her, and she bought it. Everything unraveled over time, but it wasn't until this season that she discovered the extent to which that pitch had been a complete falsehood. How can you love someone when you have no idea who he is? How could Don really love Betty, when he never allowed himself to know who she really was? She was up on a pedestal, the Madonna complete with babe in arms. When he found out about Henry, you could almost hear the gears grinding with that paradigm shift, and she became the Whore.

I do think that during the next season, Don will try to reconcile his new image of Betty, see that she's neither Madonna nor Whore, and try to let her see a little more of Don/Dick, the genuine person.

There's a "Westchester Syndrome" that people talk about today, in which women who had successful careers now find themselves stuck in the suburbs. Their husbands commute to the city, leaving before the children wake up in the morning and returning after they are asleep, so all the child-rearing is completely left to the moms. The stereotype goes: these women wait every evening till 5:00, then open a bottle of wine that they finish sometime after the kids are asleep but long before hubby gets home. What Betty and the women of their era experienced was far more difficult.

I love how the writers tried to sway sympathy/empathy from Don to Betty and back again this season. They are both flawed characters (aren't we all), but if we ignored personal experiences, the tennis match was great!
I have personal reasons to hate Don. My dad cheated on my mother-multiple times perhaps. I hated the Don/Suzanne thing, but I was on board for team Don this week!
Love this show! I will be watching seasons 1-3 this winter-with cocktail in hand!
Bravo!!

American Revolution - they threw the Brits out. Almost makes Pryce an honorary frenchman - Lafayette? Don has always suffered from moral relativism but he IS consistent. Screw around on your partner just don't break up the family. Roger violated that code and Don looked down on him. Better has violated that code and been ironically called a whore while if she only slept with HF but kept the marriage together, Don could have probably dealt with that. Leadership. We saw some of the best of that with Roger saying to Pete "this man is your commanding officer." Now we see it with Don. Don conceived this thing and then LED Peggy, Pete, Burt, and even Roger to some extent. Now that they're no longer working for a corporate machine they ARE a band of brothers. Very egalitarian. Bravo to Bert and Pryce for forgoing safety and taking this huge leap. They will obviously be energized as a result. Even Roger is this regard. The looks on the faces of those at SC right after "we've been robbed." It's much worse than picked as they realize when the look in Peggy's office - "we weren't picked."

Quite pleased that Joan Harris (Holloway) is back in action. Her brief hiatus left a small wound, that scabbed over and now is starting to heal somewhat! She is the very flesh and blood of this series. She was the caregiver to all at SC, a support person, but a darn savvy one. I am happy that she is being recognized as an essential component of the business as she ought to be. Operationally, nobody knew what to do without her. I predict that her ARMY spouse will be killed in the looming Vietnam "conflict/war" and this will enable her to again be available to maybe Roger? We'll see. Dick/Don's marital problems have really paved the way for his newfound respect for the female gender. Nothing could be more positive than this happening! Go Peggy! Loved the nervous poodle metaphor she used too, when Dick/Don assumed she would simply follow along. Go writers! Can't wait for the next batch of episodes as we explore civil rights, Vietnam, feminism, oh the possibilities...until then my “On Demand” cable function will have to tide me over. :-)

Ok, my take on the bedroom scene?

Indeed Don is something of a hypocrite in calling Betty a whore, but he believes she has been sleeping with HF (and she HAS been having an emotional affair), lording it over him as the bad guy when SHE has also been sabotaging the marriage. Remember, Betty was kissing and writing HF BEFORE Don hooked up with Suzanne. Which had the greater impact on the Draper marriage?

And what is a whore? It is a person who gives themselves to a person for money (status?) instead of love. Guess what....Betty is whore.

Did anyone else notice (maybe it was those extra large seats) how very very small (and old) HF looked, asleep in his seat? I have NEVER seen D/D looking small or old. Betty is definitely trading down down down.

@WestchesterMom: Re "Westchester Syndrome," on behalf of my wife and myself, four words: cry me a river. There are situations much worse to be in.

Quite pleased that Joan Harris (Holloway) is back in action. Her brief hiatus left a small wound, that scabbed over and now is starting to heal somewhat! She is the very flesh and blood of this series. She was the caregiver to all at SC, a support person, but a darn savvy one. I am happy that she is being recognized as an essential component of the business as she ought to be. Operationally, nobody knew what to do without her. I predict that her ARMY spouse will be killed in the looming Vietnam "conflict/war" and this will enable her to again be available to maybe Roger? We'll see. Dick/Don's marital problems have really paved the way for his newfound respect for the female gender. Nothing could be more positive than this happening! Go Peggy! Loved the nervous poodle metaphor she used too, when Dick/Don assumed she would simply follow along. Go writers! Can't wait for the next batch of episodes as we explore civil rights, Vietnam, feminism, oh the possibilities...until then my “On Demand” cable function will have to tide me over. :-)

wow !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

joan returns. YAY!

Don, Roger, Burt, and Pryce all gain their independence - remember don drawing the flag during the reorganization meeting and bert offering pryce tea for information.

I loved their faces hearing the name of their company for the first time out loud when joannnie answers the phone!

Wow!! Just a great season! I knew if I had patience, it would pay off....also proud of myself for figuring the team would buy back SC. I do have a couple of comments. First, about Don and Peggy. Remember that not only did he know about her pregnancy, but when he got in a jam with the comic's wife last season, it was Peggy he called to bail him out and cover his backside. Don and Peggy have a history of secrets between them that few other people are privy to. He deals with her differently than he does with any other woman in his life. Second, can someone refresh my memory......who did Duck go to work for? Was it McCann? If so and that's who he was trying to recruit Peggy to work for, it will make for an interesting dynamic next season. Last.....am I the only one who thinks there is something weird about Henry Francis? Too slick.....too smooth? Betty is so clueless. Her children? All she says to them is: "Go upstairs!" Why would we be surprised that she left them at Christmas to satisfy her own selfishness? But why is Henry in such a rush for her to divorce? He took her to the lawyer and now he's on the plane with her. I'm in my state of withdrawal now. I hate to wish time away, but I can't wait for Season 4!!!

@dondraperesq - Geez, that response was a little rough don't you think? I agree that there are many situations a mother and her children could find themselves in in life that could be "worse", but, hey, it's all relative isn't it? If your family life is similar to what was described in the earlier post and your wife is fine with it then kudos to her. But I would think that it would be very hard to deal with for many women and shouldn't be summarily dismissed as you just did.

Back to the episode, at those of you who were discussing the bedroom scene between Don and Betty: I too wondered during the scene if it was taking a sexually charged turn, albeit very subtly. I thought that it was another demonstration of how they never really loved each other per se, but were rather brought together by physical attraction/passion and mutual needs (hers for a certain lifestyle, his for improved status). I certainly never thought that there was ever a moment when he would force himself on her. That would have been disappointing and out of character in my opinion, but yes, there was some extra energy going on in there I think. But then again, that look he gave her when he walked out!! Brrr.....ice cold....

wwddd? -

I was getting ready to make a big post but you hit on most of the points.

In the end, Don's life is actually shaping up how Dick Whitman would want it too.

"I never wanted to work in a place like this." Then in the final scene he walks out and sees a bunch of people working together in a small hotel room and he is an equal partner in the creation just like he told Burt that he wanted to do.

Betty helped "Don Draper" make the full transition to upper middle class from Dick Whitman.

He did love Betty when they were married, but could not commit to something he would never truly be. She was a real wife that became his fake wife and the only reality is that he wants to be a father to his real kids.

Now Betty gives him the out, she is leaving him for another man. She was never going to get him any father without showing more and more resentment unlike Trudy to Pete. He will be rich, single, and his own boss. Self -made so to speak.

As soon as they announced the idea for the new firm, I knew Joan would be back. Very well written on how they brought her back.

For next season some potential humdingers:

Henry Francis dies before Betty and he get married and she has no one to take care of her...and fails to woo back Don. I can see Don saying to her in a climatic scene.
"Betts. I don't love you anymore."

Trudy finds out about the baby.

Peggy gets pregnant from Duck.

Rodger and/or Burt die.

Don hooks up with with the young chick from California group again.

Someone disgruntled from the old SC like Kinsey goes postal.

It will be fun to see them bringing old co-workers back as the firm succeeds, but it will only be one or two. Pete could bring Kenny back, but as his boss - nice twist, but I think the show will be looking to trim the salary demands of the entire cast and bring in new people and the creation of SCDP also helped that.

Obviously these characters are more faceted than all of this, but those are my thoughts.

Henry is in a hurry because he thinks 1964 will have him out on the road with Rocky in the primaries battling Goldwater. Also, he will needs some time for the ink to dry before the marriage. As he said to the divorce attorney the last thing the campaign needs is another divorce scandal. Little does Henry know that Rocky's campaign is going nowhere.

"And, the reason I hate seeing their marriage end is because the children suffer."

So, it's better for the children to live with two stifled parenets who no longer love each other in a home that's one in name only? Just because parents stay together does not mean there is real love--or a real sense of security--there. I've never been able to understand this kind of reasoning.

"And, the reason I hate seeing their marriage end is because the children suffer."

So, it's better for the children to live with two stifled parents who no longer love each other in a home that's one in name only? Just because parents stay together does not mean there is real love--or a real sense of security--there. I've never been able to understand this kind of reasoning.

Wow, now I have to wait for another season. :(
That last scene culminates in the old gang in that hotel room. It reminded me of "The Dirty Dozen" when he (telly Sevalis) finally picked his crack staff. Or in the "Mission Impossible" shows when the best of the best are gathered, to prepare for battle. I got excited.
It was a paired down lean and mean SC back doing what they do best: "sell happiness".
I'll miss you all,
b

"Their relationship is a façade, a piece of marketing that Don just couldn’t quite sell to her in the long run."

Heh. Beautifully put...:)

Great episode.
I got so excited seeing the old gang assembled in that hotel room. It was like Telly Sevalis getting his "Dirty Dozen" team together for battle.
Or the "Mission Impossible" scenes where they have the best of the best, ready to fight.
Now SC can get back to what they do best: "Sell Happiness"

Wow! What a coup that Don and Roger got everyone together and onboard their new firm, burned the midnight oil getting all of the account documents together, wheeled file cabinets out of Sterling Cooper, and holed up at the Pierre to start over. GREAT episode - I watched the finale and then watched the encore presentation of it again!

LOVE, love, love this show - never know what will happen. I think my favorite quote from the finale was Pete Campbell who said, when approached by Don and Roger about joining them, "I want my name on the wall AND in the lobby," to which Don said, "There won't BE a lobby." My second favorite part was when they were all at Sterling Cooper trying to get all of the paperwork they needed and someone said, "Does anyone know where all of this stuff is?" Roger said, "I know who to call..." and I KNEW it was Joanie. Fabulous!

Can't wait until the next season starts!

"Don and Betty: the marriage was in the dumper long ago...might as well get it over with, except I feel soooo sorry for the kids. Thank goodness they have Carla is all I can say."

...yeah, but for how long? ;) I'll be interested to see just how long Carla hangs in there once the 60's really get rolling and real job opportunities for African-Americans open up.

Three reasons I can think of why Henry told Betty not to take anything from Don in the Divorce:

1) He makes her pretty much dependent on him (unless and until she can sell the house). It's a hook.

2) It makes the divorce much quicker and simpler. If she was trying to take a bunch of his money, Don may not have been as quick to accede. Remember, Betty needed not just the 6 weeks, but Don's agreement to get the quicky divorce.

3) If Betty made a play for the money, Don may well have filed papers against Betty alleging adultery...and naming Henry! As they said, last thing they needed was another scandal. Rockefeller would have to run Henry off.

As you can see, NONE of these are for Betty's interests. They are for Henry's!

And why is Henry forcing the issue? Because he loves Bets? If he loved her, he'd want what's best for her and the kids. No...it's because he's got the hots for her and he couldn't get in her pants until he convinced her he was in it for marriage. Not to say many guys wouldn't do the same thing. Older guy, young beautiful woman. But Bets...you aren't marrying the power you think. Rocky's gone next year and Henry with him.

The whole divorce setup looks rushed. I think there must be a term for a divorce like this; perhaps "fantasy divorce" which I'll define as one where given the divorce, that a rich guy will ensure that you have no financial responsibilities (though Don could surely afford them). Nice circumstances especially for a guy that could be blackmailed into poverty. I shudder to think how high the divorce rate would go if that were always the case. This is in addition to the fact that Henry Francis barely knows Betty but wants her and her three children no string attached.

Of course, this conveniently sets up Don to lead his new life as an entrepreneur. Speaking of which; I wasn't sure Don had it in him to do what it takes re: mending fences etc. God knows he seems to cultivate enmities but there he was sucking up even to Pete (let alone Roger and Peggy). Why not Ken; he could trust Ken.

In the end, he sees his future as bright and "mavericky" and so felt comfortable letting betty go. Frankly, I think he's kind of enthused.

I don't know whether to love Don or hate him; to admire him or to detest him. You have to respect his abilities but when the show started I would have pegged him as a people person even if he wasn't just one of the people. He seemed to have a great sense of how to handle people (as opposed to him just being merely flaky with women and his life at large) but the last season or so has shown him to be quite the opposite. He makes enemies and the stuff he said to CH was appalling. I know that the writers were trying to make a point with his needing Roger et. al. (vs. the Don Draper show) but I think it was kind of clumsy and inconsistent.

I love Roger's lines. He's so droll tossing off those incredible one-liners. His acting is amazing.

boop, it was Lee Marvin who headed up the dirty dozen. Telly Savalas was a disgusting character who murdered a woman, and almost blew the whole caper.

A 'the last season was a dream' episode. The writers found a clumsy way to get the show back to it's core group, Burt, Roger, Don, Peggy, Joan, Pete.

Don is clearly back in his element. Burt, Roger, Pete, Peggy, Pryce all rejected the idea of leaving yet he convinces them all procing what a pitchman he is.....

A 'the last season was a dream' episode. The writers found a clumsy way to get the show back to it's core group, Burt, Roger, Don, Peggy, Joan, Pete.

Don is clearly back in his element. Burt, Roger, Pete, Peggy, Pryce all rejected the idea of leaving yet he convinces them all procing what a pitchman he is.....

I admit, I haven't read all the comments yet, but read enough in the upper thread to make a few corrections:

First: Always watch MM with closed captioning. The characters mumble -- a LOT! Don said to Peggy: "I will spend the rest of my life trying to hire you"

RMG: "Fourth: If Betty is going to stay in Reno for 6 weeks, why doesn't Don, the father of her children-owner of the damned house live in the house? Ummm, doesn't Carla have her own family to tend to?"

Exactly my thoughts.

The killer last night for me was Roger's line to Don when Don and Bert were trying to sell Roger on buying back SC. Roger said: "You don't understand what I do because you don't value relationships".

The entire episode centered on the people in Don's life that he had burned at one point or another and now finds himself in need of their loyalty. Betty, Roger, Pete and Peggy each made clear their grievances with Don. Interestingly, it was Don's wife, Betty, which received no form of apology. Roger, Pete, and Peggy each got Don's admission that he needed them. However, Don was still unable to value the most important relationship of all, his relationship with his wife and therefore his children. Will Don attempt to save his marriage next season? It may be too lat for that. Only MW knows for sure.

The catalyst to all of this, of course, was the man who first befriended and then forced Don into the contract that eliminated his freedom. Was this the first time Don found himself on the receiving end of "its just business"? It's hard to believe Conrad Hilton was the first person to have ever put Don in that position.