Talk is a public forum where you can ask questions and share your commentary with fellow Mad Men fans.
Why Duck seduced Peggy:
1. He thinks she slept with Don.
2. She had whiskey on her breath.
I predict Duck sneering at Don and saying "I had your girl." Don will think he means Betty and pull on ol' Archibald Whitman move on him.
http://www.politico.com/click/stories/0909/draper_saves_the_sharks.html
On a side note - the 80s want their jacket back.
"The Mad Men go through various emotions."
http://www.sesamestreet.org/video_player?p_p_lifecycle=0&p_p_id=videoPlayer_WAR_sesameportlets4369&p_p_uid=90b9a619-0769-42fc-bf9f-0258aa40cbfe
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YgvKCfZqxrQ
Why is AMC only showing 1 episode of season 3? I'm unable 2 afford more channels on my satellite/cable only can get basic, of course AMC is not in the basic channel line up...would love 2 watch this show, but can't now b/c AMC will not upload Full viewing episodes online...???
Just for fun, let's see how many items of the written Hobo Code apply or do not apply to the characters on the show.List will be first comment
C'mon, Maddicts. I'm at a loss. After this last episode (and all that has led us to this point), I'm tempted to dismiss all these jokers as despicable. It doesn't help that many of them are working in a much maligned profession. I mean, they push death with no compunctions in the form of war machines and cigarettes. Money and power are their gods. Appearances are everything. They are all liars and manipulators, or worse. Can someone help me find a reason to wish good things for them? Is any one of them redeemable?
NOTHING good can come out of that...
Although Peggy is inching her way up in the business world, she is completely lost in the Game Between Men and Women. Her seduction efforts with Hamburger Guy were painful to watch and when she is the seductee, she capitulates in 1.5 seconds, losing the entire thrill of the chase, which is often even more fun than the culmination. She's a nice Brooklyn girl with no clue. As a first step in helping Peggy learn to communicate, I propose we should design her some cyber tee shirts to wear to convey her sexual messages. For example, one that would say "I M E-Z" when she is looking to hook up, or one that says,"You can't touch this" when she is playing hard to get. (She really does need to learn how to play that one!)
Ok, sophisticated men and women of the MM forum, design Peggy a shirt!
OK, I'll start this, and we'll see if it goes anywhere. Maybe it was Season 2 or Season 1 we see the flashback of Dick Whitman's childhood, and the "hobo" who stays with his family for a while and does some odd jjobs for them. Dick's father stiffs the guy, and the hobo makes a mark on a pole or tree near their farm that basically is a message to other drifters not to stop there, because the man of the house is not honest or ethical or whatever. From this we can infer that the sp-called "Hobo Code" involves:
--Paying a fair wage for a day's work
--Treating people fairly regardless of their position in life
--Taking in strangers in need and sharing what you can spare
--Never steal (unless it's from a dead person, who won't miss it anyway).
--The freedom to come and go as you please--not to be tied down.
Does Dick/Don use the Hobo Code as his moral compass? I would say so, especially since his father was such a lousy role model, and he needed some better rules to live by. In Dick's case, the Hobo Code was a step up. Any thoughts?
The Journal News just updated its interactive Mad Men map for Westchester, now featuring new landmarks in Ossining, Tarrytown, Larchmont and New Rochelle: http://lohud.com/madmen
"This is very cool." ~Rich Sommer, via Twitter
It looks like Don is gearing up for a fight with Roger. I feel more than a bit apprehensive about this. Both men are formidable opponents. Don can be ruthless and cunning, but Roger is childish, vindictive and "does not like to be judged." I don't know which one would be worse to have as an enemy. We're accustomed to seeing Don be the victor in all his combat situations, but lately that seems to have changed.
Both Roger and Don endured humbling experiences during the most recent episodes. Don wasn't promoted and Roger was forgotten - accidentally, or was he being given a message? To heal their wounded pride, both men have to take action of some sort. Don was trying to reestablish control at work by not signing the contract and taking out his anger at Peggy. He failed with both attempts. Bert blackmailed him and Peggy is establishing independence from Don.
What is Roger going to do to reestablish himself as a power at SC? How much time is needed to schmooze with the really big accounts? Not much I think. Personally I would like to see Roger actually pay attention to his employees, to at least try to create a bond of loyalty should Don ever attempt to jump ship in the future and take them with him, but that is never going to happen. Roger's too much of a snob. Though it would be hilarious to see him trying to make conversation at a series of lunches with his own staff. "So, Peggy... Olson, is that a Swedish name?" "Sal, have I ever met your wife?"
What should Roger do to make himself a player in the firm, instead of a person "penciled in" on a transparency for the overhead projector?
Hi everyone -
First wanted to make a few comments about Ossining:
Last season, I recall betty opening a phone bill and seeing their address - Bullet Park Dr, Ossining NY - printed on the envelope. This season, it seems as though it appears in each epi - the policeman that delivers the bad news about GG drives up to the house with an Ossining Car, and the Sing Sing prison guard that tells don, "... you've probably had a dream where you wind up there.." are the two most notable. Finally, most of epi "seven twenty three" takes place in and around Ossining, the campaign advisor and betty make a date to hike the reservoir, you see Ossining on the contract don signs, it is referred to as a ghost town in the summer, and "...interesting mix of people..." live there, etc...
Second a few comments about the blood this season:
Many people have posted they think the numerous images of blood are foreshadowing the assassination of JFK. What if the assassination of JFK, coupled with the slow deconstruction of don, pushes him to his breaking point . after all, if it weren't for the children , don probably would have skipped town by now. Perhaps this is foreshadowing an act of violence that don, himself, might commit.
The motives:
Two possibilities come to mind; the not so innocent school teacher threatens to reveal their affair to betty (in the affair they most likely will have) or don discovers the affair betty will most likely have with the campaign advisor.
I used to think of Don as exactly what he is BUT that REALLY is not the case. He is a metaphor for the 50's and early 60's and I lived it. He is hiding constantly. Even his wife does not know a thing about him and when his father-in-law passed away he could NOT EVEN tell someone who was in the office. Not to mention the contract ... it was ABSOLUTELY within Betty's rights to know about it. They are in a life together NOT alone but she may as well be alone and she feels it. She's lonely. I understand that. That was something anyone would want to know. He is a secretive, hidden man and I think it is telling about the era. It has to do with his Dick Whitman past BUT I also think it has to do with who he is. I think even if Dick Whitman were known he would perhaps still be that way but it is much more I think evident because he is ashamed of his background and his background is ANYTHING but Madison Avenue. He wants it to be but it isn't. His background is Appalachia where he comes from but shunned. I think that is a product of the 60's always having to hide and be ashamed of so much and I think Madison Avenue is a metaphor for that age when pretenses were up and the realness of who a person was was not acceptable to reveal. So much is hidden most especially the dark places. One just could NOT talk about oneself. Peggy can't, Joan can't, certainly Tony the gay man surely cannot, Joan's friend who made a lesbian pass at her it was dismissed totally not even discussed. Such a personal feeling not even talked about. The other girl must have felt mortified that she even revealed such a personal feeling....NOTHING of psychological or sociological import and substance is talked about. Not even the guy who has a black girlfriend. That is totally ignored but the racism is there.
The kid who hit Don in the motel room mentioned Vietnam and that he was going to be married as a way to avoid the draft. In those days you could avoid it if you had marital responsibilities. A solider does NOT say he is scared. There is still a blemish on that. On Madison Ave one has to come off as competent, and tough even when you are not. Many things are true today BUT it is a MUCH MUCH more open milieu. Oprah talks about it all and THAT is a metaphor for OUR time!
I heard two references to August in last Sunday's episode. Sally's teacher telling Don she is off for the month of August.
And Pete having a conversation with Paul, Ken and Harry about he likes "this time of year because it's so quiet". Just prior to the guys coming into his office, Pete was reading Ebony magazine.
I think the writers are getting us ready for the March on Washington coming up in August.
I can see Sally's teacher attending, and who knows...maybe Pete?
Well personally i wish it was like 24 episodes like every other show, but i guess it keepsit fresh, but anywho i have my Answers i just wanna hear what my fellow Fans have to say.
When Don asks Pete about how it's going with North American Aviation, Campbell says this:
"It's going well! My friend Russ, who deals with McNamara's office, said the orders are through the roof for helicopters, carbines and especially jets for Viet Nam! I think I've convinced North American they're going to have to spend more if they want to get out of NASA and into the Pentagon."
Don says, "Well, when they do, we can talk about Hilton."
I was sickened by this glib kind of talk, when recalling the bombing, the napalm, the body counts, the mess that was the Viet Nam War. All I could think of was Bob Dylan's song, "Masters of War". Comments?
The second Duck Phillips made his shocking re-entry into the world of Mad Men, I knew he was about to become a major villain. I love the way his character's downfall has been portrayed over two seasons. We were introduced to him as the recovered alcoholic, turning the corner by trying to run a successful ad firm's accounts, but slowly, things began to go wrong. As conflict and disappointment creeps up, Duck slumps into depression, and as any addict can attest, is tempted by the devil. And unfortunately, because Mr. Phillips isn't a strong person, the devil wins.
And now, fresh off the heels of his being removed from SC, his false-confidence has turned him into a "Jekyl/Hyde" of sorts. The cleverly disguised phone call to Pete was just the beginning, but I had no idea how far they'd take it. Seducing Peggy, the literal symbol of innocence and the roots of Feminism in our story, has to be the most devilish thing I can imagine him doing.
I certainly hope good wins over evil in this one, and Peggy comes to her senses, because that was probably one of the most horrific things I've seen on this series, and let's be honest, we've been through a lot (Don's power play on Bobbie at the restaurant, and Guy losing a foot, come to mind). But I don't think we've seen just how low Duck Phillips is willing to stoop to get what he's got to be ultimately looking for: revenge on Don Draper.
Props to Mark Moses for playing this role so well!
Here, in no particular order, is my weekly list of things I loved in this episode:
1. That Christina Hendricks' name is still in the opening credits. It gives me great hope that our dear Joanie will return.
2. Betty, foreshadowing Peggy Lipton, Angie Dickinson, Charlie's Angels, and other great policewomen with her adminition to Bobby to "Freeze!"
3. Bobby Draper, for following his mother's instructions to hang up the phone a little too literally.
4. Swensen's Bakery. Loved the styrofoam wedding cakes in the window and the waitresses' outfits with the funky little hats. Though the cake box that was shown should have been white, tied with string, not pink.
5. Betty's ensemble in the Swensen's Bakery scene. The dress, the sunglasses and the white gloves were all perfect, but boy, it must have been awful to wear gloves on a sweltering July day.
6. Bert Cooper calling Conrad Hilton an eccentric.
7. The look that Don's secretary, Allison, gave Don, when he said to her "hold all my calls" when he went in to see Conrad Hilton. The look was like "duh, like I would ever interrupt your meeting with Conrad Hilton!"
8. Carlton's hat in the eclipse scene. It had some kind of feather in it. Also love Don's exchange with Carlton: "You stare at the sun?" "You run?"
9. The Greek chorus hovering outside Don's office and Don's "I told you not to let them hover" to Allison.
10. Duck's "have you been to Grey? It's a Penn Station toilet with venetian blinds."
No contact with Roger?...Say it ain't so. How can we lose those after victory drinking bouts? Roger's waxing philsophical over what women want... He and Don dueling over oysters...Roger taking one for the road...Thats my car...Lights...No, no, they can't take that away from us...
The way Rog drops bald hints...
The way they sip whiskey...
The way they love to spar...No, no they can't take that away from we...
The way Don slapped him down...
The way Rog rode Mirabelle in...
The way he called Don "Rochester".. No, no they can't take that away from we...
The way Don seemed amused...
The moves Rog put on Betty...
The way they make us howl...No, no they can't take away Slattery...
No, they can't take Roger away from we...
It's Batman without Robin...Beatrice without Benedict...Matt Dillon without Festus...Henry Frankenstein without Praetorius...Lewis without Clark...Jefferson without Adams...Burns without Allen...Crosby without Hope...Lucy without Desi...
The lure of orange hair...
The bottom of the glass you couldn't see...
The way he called Pete Paul...No, no they can't take that away from we... No, they can't take that away from we...
Did anyone else think this: did Betty remind you of a Renaissance painting?
It was a theme done over and over with a similiar piece of furniture and the beautiful siren lying prone, to be admired. That's exactly what we see with Betty, an illusion to a Renaissance painting. Look at the first shot of her, the soft lighting, the comfort and contentment of her, her arm behind her head not exactly but similar to the idea of posing.
Posing for us the viewer.
That's her character. Self-centered Betty lying there for all of us to admire. Betty enjoying the admiring of Henry, the man showing her attention. Betty, the former model, enjoying being adored, an object of beauty waiting to be painted.
It really is all about attention with Betty.
Talk about Season 3, Episode 6, "Guy Walks Into an Advertising Agency."
I could see this coming from the episode where Duck invited peat and Peggy to lunch and I was still shocked. I personally think that duck is a step up for Peggy relationship wise. after all hes single and not bad looking. and I think he sees just how much potential she has.
on the other hand I cant help but wonder if this is all just a ruse in order to get back at don or something. I know how underhanded Duck was in initiation the British invasion in the last season.
what are your thoughts?
We got two literary references in last night's episode.
The book by David Ogilvy called "Confessions of an Advertising Man".
And Rachel Carson's "Silent Spring" which documented the use of DDT and its lethal effect on birds and wildlife. It came out in September of 1962.
Betty's elder commmitte woman mentioned it during their discussion of the reservoir petition.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Silent_Spring
WHEN will you learn that no one UNDER 30 can be trusted? Will you never realise that you are on the other side of youth....and that these kids "ain't gonna do you no favors."
Searching the underbellies of our characters, if you could take MM down the sick and twisted, silly or tasteless highway, what would you have happen to the characters?
Maybe no era has good taste when it comes to a certain suburban group of people and their home--and that includes the taste of their interior decorator. But the early 60's there seem to have been particularly...horrible...when it came to interior design. And I can't figure out why.
I mean, there was marvelous, modern stylized furniture out there as well. Styles that are still hip and sold today. But that's not the sort we'd find in the Draper's brand new living room--and what we're seeing there was typical of American homes of the time. Furniture heavy, clunky, dark, mismatched. Did anyone think that living room was aesthetically pleasing? (And, yes, the fainting couch made it worse).
Obviously, there are eras with good styles and bad, like good clothing fashion and bad. But what was the aesthetic of that era, and why did people find it appealing? Or did they?
(I hate that phrase, btw, but it was a popular one back in the day). I've always pretty much admired Don for promoting Peggy out of the secretarial pool. I feel she earned her way out. Notice the differences between how Don talked to Pete about wanting in on Hilton and how he practically lashed out at Peggy for asking the same thing? Pete was informed that he should be the one getting the accounts and Don is to be begging to work on them....and how is the American thing going? OK, succeed with that and we'll talk about Hilton...Pete left the room with his dignity in tact.
Peggy, however, got the dressing down...reminded that she was once just a secretary and all her hard work is basically something Don could have lived without. "Keep your nose down....stop asking for things". Well, I guess Coop made him gulp his own medicine later, reminding Don how grateful he should be just to be working there.
A few episodes ago, Miss Farrell, in her slightly tipsy phone call to the Draper residence, engaged in overt flirtation with Don. Now, in episode 7, she seems offended by what she takes as a come-on from him. Which is it that she wants: his attention, or for him to leave her alone?
Will the real Miss Farrell please stand up?
Betty is on the edge. Did she or did'nt she "quickly jiggle" the drawer on Don's desk after she hung up with H.Francis?
This video with Matt Weiner and some cast members is excellent. Even the Clorox ad at the beginning is good!
Source: www.amctv.com
http://www.salon.com/ent/tv/feature/2009/09/28/mad_men/
http://www.ew.com/ew/article/0,,20308534,00.html
http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/blogs/tgoodman/detail?&entry_id=48460
(Not for the weak stomached - picture of Duck and Peggy in bed...)
http://latimesblogs.latimes.com/showtracker/2009/09/mad-men-seven-thirty-seven.html
(same picture in this article - eewww)
http://www.nj.com/entertainment/tv/index.ssf/2009/09/mad_men_seven_twenty_three_rev.html
http://featuresblogs.chicagotribune.com/entertainment_tv/2009/09/mad-men-seven-twenty-three.html
don and betty are doomed - she blocked the soul of her home with a hideous couch and then we can presume, fantasizes about another man. this might be the final straw for me - i have always wanted to see don and betts work it out - not sure i want to see that anymore - bring back rachel menken!
The interior decorator said: nothing should go where they were standing. "It's the hearth" - the focal point where the family gathers; the heart of the home.
That's Betty's desire. So what does Betty do? She shoehorns in that gargantuan lump of a victorian fainting couch. Those Draper kids are going to be in therapy soon.
aside: I bet Peggy could make that couch come in handy in more than one way - if Betty unloads it.
Some people say a man is made outta mud
A poor man's made outta muscle and blood
Muscle and blood and skin and bones
A mind that's a-weak and a back that's strong
You load sixteen tons, what do you get
Another day older and deeper in debt
Saint Peter don't you call me 'cause I can't go
I owe my soul to the company store
I was born one mornin' when the sun didn't shine
I picked up my shovel and I walked to the mine
I loaded sixteen tons of number nine coal
And the straw boss said "Well, a-bless my soul"
You load sixteen tons, what do you get
Another day older and deeper in debt
Saint Peter don't you call me 'cause I can't go
I owe my soul to the company store
I was born one mornin', it was drizzlin' rain
Fightin' and trouble are my middle name
I was raised in the canebrake by an ol' mama lion
Cain't no-a high-toned woman make me walk the line
You load sixteen tons, what do you get
Another day older and deeper in debt
Saint Peter don't you call me 'cause I can't go
I owe my soul to the company store
If you see me comin', better step aside
A lotta men didn't, a lotta men died
One fist of iron, the other of steel
If the right one don't a-get you
Then the left one will
You load sixteen tons, what do you get
Another day older and deeper in debt
Saint Peter don't you call me 'cause I can't go
I owe my soul to the company store
--Written by Merle Travis, whose father was a coal miner in Kentucky
--Sung by 'Tennessee' Ernie Ford, Frankie Laine, The Platters, and Johnny Cash. Ford had a number one hit with it in 1955.
It doesn't beat the John Deere Tractor but it sure comes close.
Duck.
The hitchhikers for coming up with such a convoluted robbery plan that really shouldn't succeed, or Don, for allowing it to succeed anyway. "Pay me with drugs? Why sure! And I'd love to party with you in your motel room!"
Now we know the significance of this date; Don signs a contract and he is now tethered to something that goes against his very being. And given his behavior with those kids, it feels like he's on a descent into some kind of an abyss. But perhaps even more importantly, this date signifies exactly 4 months until Roger's daughter's wedding; 11/23/1963. And of course, more blood was spilled as it has been in each of the last few episodes. IMHO, everything is directly and indirectly leading up to the crescendo of JFK's assassination.
I loved the scene with Don and Burt in which Don finally signs the contract. The lighting was particularly effective, Burt looked positively devilish. "I owe my soul to the company store" indeed. What did everyone else think?
I mentioned this in another post but could it be that the teacher's strange behavior masks an affair between her and Don? Her strangely bitter remarks to him and the fragments between them...The strange phone call...The "Old Kentucky Home" end shot that seemed to show Don (or someone) in an embrace...Could it be that she and Don in public are feigning not to know each other while carrying on in private? And this one time, to confuse us, Matt and co are not showing us what's going on?
After Conrad's strange conversation with Don, I can see where Paris (assuming a relation) gets it from. What was all that? And this need to rope Don in with a contract?
I await the episode where Conrad and Burt welcome Don to ...The Club.
Betty seems pretty casual about Don's overnight absence...And his "fender-bender" injury. Perhaps the fainting couch has affected her?
And the teacher? What the heck? She seems to be obsessed with Don rather than vice-versa, given the earlier episode where she had that bizarre near-faint while talking to him by phone. Apparently, despite the "Old Kentucky Home" ending she and Don are not yet involved outside perhaps a mutual fantasy but it's still very weird....In fact Burt, Betty, the teacher...All around weird behavior on MM tonight.
After 3 years of cheering Don's independence on and seeming to be perfectly happy risking the Brit buyout suddenly Burt is putting the screws and how to Dick/Don, even threatening him in a rather unmistakable way? Surely Hilton can't be that big a deal... Very strange change in Mr. C. I suppose it could be Burt protecting his "boy" Roger but it still doesn't quite seem like our Burt.
I was encouraged by my fellow Maddicts to share my amazing experience being on Mad Men, if only as a background actor. What was thrilling was, I got a bit of camera time, and was in shaking hands distance many times that day of Jon Hamm, Ryan Cutrona and January Jones.
How did I get there? My journey to the set that day was pretty wild, bumpy, and like no other roller coaster I had been on! It had it's emotional highs and devastating lows, but I got there, and like Scarlett O'Hara shaking her fist in the distance, as she stood on her beloved Tara soil, I knew I would get to the set to work on a show I love so much.
As an actor, this show defines why I became an actor: I consider myself a storyteller, and with Mad Men come brilliant storytelling, complex character, and writing that is scintillating. Weiner and his writers trust us to follow along, without holding our hand. They fold their stories, plots and characters like complex origami shapes, that we, as the audience, relish to understand how it's put together, and like little kids at bedtime, our ears grow hungry for more story. At the end of each episode I find myself literally crying out, "MORE! MORE! What happens next?"
So, without further ado, this is how my journey to Mad Men began:
In mid April, my Facebook friend Daria, who knew what a Maddict I am, shoots me a wall post, to let me know that there is an open call for Mad Men, for background actors. She sends me all of the information, the contact phone #, all of it. After about a day, and mustering my courage, I make a phone call to an information line, laying out the rules for the Mad Men call. I realize that, no matter what was on my agenda, there was no friggin' way I was going to miss the open call. I cleared my schedule, painstakingly picked out a Mad Men-esque type of look, booked my flight, hotel and rental car, and on April 24th, in the afternoon, I arrived at Central Casting in Los Angeles. As I touched up my makeup and bucked up my courage to walk in Central Casting's front door, I froze. My hands started to shake, and I was bulldozed with a huge case of the nerves. I wanted to be on Mad Men so badly, and yet, I started to worry, thinking about all the gorgeous women on that show, that I didn't measure up. "I'm too old, too odd looking, I don't measure up." All the while, my hands were shaking like an alcoholic who hadn't had a drink in 24 hours. I watched actors leaving Central Casting, who all looked young and beautiful, and I didn't know what to do. Finally, I got fed up with myself, and realized that if I left, I spent a whole lotta energy for nothin'. So here went nothing....I opened my car door and headed for the front door of Central Casting....
(more to follow in my next post)
let's see - chicken salad on ritz crackers, pineapple cheese ball with more crackers, chex party mix, sloppy joes on little parkerhouse rolls, jello mold, shrimp cocktail arranged on a "snack porcupine", cocktail nut mix, some kind of fondue or cheesy crabby dip in a chafing dish, rumaki, liver pate with cocktail rye.
with a manhattan (or old fashioned, vodka gimlet).
and a lipitor chaser.
anything else? Need to start cooking soon.
...for the Marathon today. That was the fastest six hours I've ever spent watching TV. We Maddicts never get enough of this unique, amazing show. THANK YOU!!!
Oh the mystery of Don! Unlock your creative side and give your synopsis. Pull back those veils of Don.
When Tracy and Pete Campbell are touring their new apartment with her parents (after they agreed to help with the down payment) and the realtor, who makes/where can I find a coat/jacket similar to Tracy Campbell's? It' pink and navy and adorable!
If photograher Diane Arbus found herself at Sterling Cooper in 1963, would she find any interesting subjects to photograph?
If so, who do you think she would snap? Personally, I think she would find Joan and Peggy together a possibility.
OK, I realize we are just to accept this as part of the plot, but I don't see all that much creative genius-ing going on. We have seen Don sleeping on the job, ducking out to have illict affairs, oops, I mean going to the printers, and powering down a lot of alcohol. He pulled a rabbit out of the hat with "Lucky Strike, it's toasted, and the Carousel was good, but that was about all. Or am I missing something?? Exactly what is it about him that the Brits are studying?
I am having the hardest time believing that Dick Whitman's non-biological mother wasn't a nice woman who loved Dick and tried to raise him as her own son. True, not the best of circumstances, that she was given Dick but she had a child. If you have been adopted or know a parent who has adopted you will understand that a child becomes yours the day you accept him into your life.
I call her no biological because the word "stepmother " connotes evil and I want to believe that Abigail was good to Dick and loved him. Archie was mean and hateful to Dick because he was a mean man (see Hobo Code episode, Season One) but Abigail...I never saw her say or do anything. So someone tell me I'm wrong.
I know it is still early (thanks God) but would any Northern California/Bay Area MM addicts like to get together to watch the final show? I live in Sacramento and they are some good spots or I have no problem travelling to San Francisco if that fits better for the majority. Comments? Thoughts? Suggestions? Let's get together to watch the final and cry in our drinks because it will be a long wait for Season four!!
HEY CHATTERBOXERS!
The Chatterbox Jazz Club is having a "Mad Men Night" Sunday 9/27, 7PM in conjunction with the Indy Jazz Fest finale.
Inspired by our love of the AMC Emmy Award winning Drama, classic jazz and friend, fashion plate, & award winning interior designer Nikki Sutton.
We feature Jared Thompson, a fashion plate in his own right, and his jazz quartet, Premium Blend, playing from 8-11PM.
Excerpts from past shows will be on our TV and the show will be on live at 10 and rebroadcast at 11pm on AMC.
Classic cocktails will be featured on special. http://www.amctv.com/originals/madmen/cocktail-guide/
Late 50's early 60's Madison Avenue attire will be rewarded with a free cocktail.
I already have my Bert Cooper suit! Are you a Don, Pete, Roger or Sal...Betty, Joan, or Peggy?
A link to the AMC website for the show is included for your costuming inspiration!
Admission is only $5 cash pp.
Bring all your friends and SEE YOU SUNDAY!
David A.
David Andrichik
davidjazz@earthlink.net
On NPR's "Fresh Air" today: Matthew Weiner, Jon Hamm, John Slattery. Actually, this is a rebroadcast from Sept 2008, but it's still a good one. You can listen to the entire 20-min interview or read the transcript -- there are also some good links at the bottom to other NPR/MM stories.
http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=113180227
(p.s. Is there a place on this site where Media Appearances -- tv/radio/mags/etc -- are posted? Do the official AMC Blog people post info like this anywhere?
If you want to see your favorite train wreck - i mean secretary - stay at SC - then post here!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2GmVajkqLNU&feature=fvw
Kind of lame?
Betty's redecorating, talking over things with her ID. Don walks in, says move the lamp and end table to the other side. Betty and the ID both think it's genius.
Really? That's supposed to whet our appetites?
I know that our dear MM is filmed in California, but I think that if trips for business or pleasure take our characters elsewhere, there are a lot of locations that would still fit the MM era. As a Minnesotan, I would love to see a scene shot at the gorgeous Foshay Tower in Minneapolis http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Foshay_Tower . Where would you like to see MM on location?
Don seemed really pleased and excited at the thought of being sent to London to work with the British branch. Why do you think that was? More money? A chance to travel abroad without Betty and the kids, at least initially? Knowing Dick Whitman would never be a danger to him on the other side of the pond? Do you think Don would be as successful with the British as he has been with American clients? Guy probably would have been fairly successful in America simply because Americans are always suckers for that accent, and , of course, the British invasion is coming, and that couldn't hurt. Don would be a Yank in London...a gorgeous Yank, but a Yank nonetheless. What do you think his chances for success would have been?
Does anyone know when the Season Finale is scheduled? I'd like to plan a Mad Men Party for that night. Is it November 8th?
Not real happy with actors who get involved in politics.
At one time I loved the "Back to the Future" movies. When MJ Fox got involved in politics, it made me sick to watch them from then on. Ditto with "Andy Griffith", never watched another show.
Never missed a Mad Man episode, have the DVD's. I hope I can watch now and see Don Draper and not a political hack in Jon Hamm.
Not real happy with actors who get involved in politics.
At one time I loved the "Back to the Future" movies. When MJ Fox got involved in politics, it made me sick to watch them from then on. Ditto with "Andy Griffith", never watched another show.
Never missed a Mad Man episode, have the DVD's. I hope I can watch now and see Don Draper and not a political hack in Jon Hamm.
This is only for silly or tasteless predictions of how the show will open in the very first scene. Sadly, no prizes unless your silly or tasteless prediction actually happens, at which time voting for what kind of prize will commence, and you will be covered in praise by your fellow Maddicts for being silly and tasteless enough to actually have thought of something Matt would actually use...
Someone asked in a thread how they could see Season 3 again. AMC is playing all Season 3 this Sunday. On my Directv listing, the shows run in the morning. I suggest you check your local listings for times.
Starting a separate thread for this so as to not disturb the real episode thread that is ONLY for talk about the show. This is only for predictions of how the show will open in the very first scene. No prizes except "Fame & Fortune" on the MadMen blog, and superiority above your peers on here, both the ones you love, and love to hate! All kidding aside, just a fun contest, join in!
...in a season of MadMen where bare feet are one of the most important symbols? (That's not me, by the way, That's Matt who said: " the bare feet, the first image (of the episode) is the story of the season in a way."
One thing is sure, Guy's loss of a foot does put everyone else's problems in perspective. Joan can probably deal with her losses better knowing that things could be worse, and Don not getting the job he expected likely sees that he's got it pretty good. Guy, after all, doesn't just lose a foot and the job he hoped to have overseeing SC, but, according to his fellow Brits, he loses all that he's been molded, shaped, geared and trained to be. He can't even, according to them, use his one great gift because he can't walk a golf course.
His entire identity, future and purpose in life was lost when he lost that foot.
Does anyone else hate her character fro being a b*&^# all the time?
I like the fact most of the men on the show including Don, Roger, Pete, and most of the others are wearing silky sheer nylon dress socks as they did back in the 60's. I started wearing these type of socks myself in the 60's and still wear them excclusively today. The look transcends the 60's and 70's timeframe and is just as good today as it was then. It's obvious men's clothing styles have been impacted by the show for men today and I would love for that to include the sheer socks. I feel certain most of the men's clothing manufacturers are watching the response of men to the Mad Men clothing styles to see if they should make them available. I would like to hear from men who are Maddicts whether you either wear the sheer socks already or if you are interrested in wearing them yourself. Please let us hear from you on this topic.
More foot jokes than you can shake a Barbie at. Link in the comments...
In the boardroom meeting in the latest episode, Guy Hendricks puts up that overhead chart of the structure of S-C. You quickly glimpse the names of various staffers, including one "Adam Rowe, Copy Chief", the copywriting counterpart to Sal's Head Art Director title. Yet we've never seen this character. It's strange, because if he does exist, writers like Peggy, Paul and Smitty would have limited access to Don and would instead report to him.
Does the name have any significance to the cast or crew?
This is just a small victory I wish to share with other Maddicts. I love to pass waiting time with a crossword puzzle and the clue was Jai ______. I know three weeks ago, I would NOT have known the answer and due to our addiction to Mad Men, I got the answer right! See how useful all this is?
This has been bugging me from the first season. Other than Sally's birthday party, we never see a neighborhood kid, much less a bunch of them, either playing in the yard with Sally and Bobby or popping into the house to retrieve a toy left behind, or use the bathroom, etc. I realize they aren't going to have a bunch of children around on a regular basis but once a season to have a friend or two sharing a glass of milk and sandwioh at lunch time would not be outrageous. Sometimes it seems like Ossinning is in outer Mongolia. Sally and Bobby ARE part of the Baby Boom generation but you'd hardly know it from their neighborhood.
Wow, it's been forever since I posted on here!
Sorry that my post is an episode behind, and thus is about something likely already discussed, but I just had a thought about Pete's conversation with Hollis in the elevator. Yes, it's plain to see that Hollis was understandably uncomfortable with the topic at hand, but do you think it could also be that Hollis isn't comfortable with Pete himself? I ask because in the last season, Hollis initiates a casual conversation with Don and Peggy regarding the death of Marilyn Monroe (and reveals that, yes, he likely does follow baseball as Pete guesses in their own conversation, or at least feels for Joe DiMaggio) In retrospect, it seems like the first conversation would be highly unlikely -- a black "servant" offering his unsolicited opinion and pity for a white sex symbol to two white "superiors", one of which is a white female -- UNLESS they were all pretty cool with each other and had established that kind of rapport. Perhaps in all their years of working in the same building, Pete has never really talked to Hollis until that point.
I would like to add "Pulling a Sadler" to the lexicon:
Definition: doing the absolute most inappropriate at exactly the wrong time. See Comments Below
As I stated in one of my earlier posts, this is how our teachers addressed us no matter what our race or religion. YOU PEOPLE IS NOT A RACIST STATEMENT. Now, for the real reason I'm posting. Why do YOU PEOPLE post that everything the characters on the show do is a metaphor. Sometimes a cigar is just a cigar.
On August 28, 1963 two young girls were brutally murdered in their apartment on East 88th Street in NYC. This incident turned into a landmark story:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Career_Girls_Murders
Although not directly related, I feel there will be a victim at Sterling Cooper before the end of this Season.
Peggy has always been the go-getter, the hard worker who never lets anything faze her. I've always seen her as unexpectedly strong. So any thoughts as to why she fainted at the sight of blood (into Pete's arms)? There must be something symbolic here, I'm just wondering what it might be.
Thirteen very astutely posited that Lane Pryce's name is an apt description of his 'way'. He counts price above other business considerations. His job is to steer down a fiscally sound 'lane'-- trim and save, don't take risks.
My theory is that the name Don Draper also offers a key to that character's behavior. According to Merriam-Webster, the word 'draper' means a dealer in cloth and sometimes in clothing and dry goods. Think about cloth, how it is used to cover things.
We know Don's an excellent salesman who subscribes to David Ogilvy's noted theory about the nature of advertising.
We also know he's a Don Juan!
Anyone want to take a stab at the name "Dick Whitman"?
Alright call me crazy, but here's my prediction: I think Sally will start "seeing" Grandpa Gene when Betty and the children are out and about, and will be taken to a child psychiatrist, until Betty realizes he's actually still alive and living in the city, a foil for Don's double identity. What do you think?
"He's about letting go of things so you get what you want" says Bert about Guy (don't know if that's an exact quote), the pure "accounts" man. Meaning, of course, that Guy does what the Brits have been doing, forcing SC to let go of employees and unprofitable accounts in order to save/make money. But this seems to refer to a lot of things people were hungry for that they didn't get. Thing they thought they wanted that they need to let go of in order to get what they really want.
Later on, Don relates the story of the too hungry snake that soffocated on what it was trying to swallow.
Thoughts?
Archie Whitman returns in the next episode (Seven Twenty Three) according to IMDb and Joseph Culp's website. No clue what this one is about. Maybe that IS Don unconscious on the floor after all?
From the folks at "Funny or Die"
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2009/09/22/protect-insurance-compani_n_294406.html
Oh Dear Lord. I just watched Hamm and Jones on Oprah. It was fun to see the actors. I never saw this woman's show before. Never will again. What a phony. Shabby treatment of Jerry Mathers in my opinion. Dumb crowd. Had to be over a hundred people in the crowd and not one of them knew that Ajax was The White Tornado. I am sure there are some Oprah fans here, I just don't know why.
So? Did ya get the joke? And I don't just mean the one about a "Guy walks into an Ad Agency..." Actually, this episode is full of black -humored jokes. And my favorite is the John Deere Tractor. I think it's a brilliant visual joke from the writers to us viewers--very literary, but what the hell? Still funny.
Think about it. Pryce (by the by, we do all know his name is also a joke? All he cares about is the "Pryce" of things?) is about to be exiled to Bombay. Joan has been told "bon voyage!" Roger has been cut out. And promotions have been blocked. The new young account fellow is going to steal everything from everyone--all their hard work and he's going to reap the rewards. Can anything save our heroes? Will the gods not set right this terrible injustice?
As in an old Greek play, the Deus Ex Machina arrives--literally, a machine--a John Deere Tractor--care of the writers if not the gods and in one horrific splatter of blood, all is put right. Pryce gets to stay, the young ad guys have a brighter future, the secretary who caused the accident will leave, making it possible for Joan to return, and Roger has a place again!
They even threw in an extra hint to make sure you got it. That this was a Greek play, I mean. The guy's foot is injured....Oedipus. The name means "swollen foot."
I love this show! :-D
Oprah was great fun today w/ Jon Hamm and January Jones as guest on her show. It was all in a great 60's theme, and the audience looked great in their Mad Men attire. I was so excited to see two of our customers in the first rows picked for those spots because of their awesome vintage clothing from T.F. A. in St. Louis, MO, Jon Hamm's home town! One customer even came back today to purchase a cool vintage glass set for their viewing party of the show. She said it was an absolute blast. Both customers said that Jon and January were very gracious and kind.
Anyone want to start speculating on what Seven Twenty Three might mean? My guesses so far: a date (July 23, 1963), part of Peggy's new address in Manhattan (7 W. 23rd Street or 723 something else) or maybe a hotel room number? The latter is because I thought the scene with the man lying on the carpet looked like it could possibly be in a hotel room. Didn't recognize the setting as any of the homes or apartments we see regularly.
Going back to the three parties episode, that was about a lot of things, and one thing I had thought was it being about lines being drawn. The three groups were basically divided with some people in the middle. Society divided up.
I'm watching Don and Betty here, and I'm seeing Betty drawing yet another line, between her and Don. It seems like Gene jr. is Betty's answer for Don's Sally. This marriage and family is seeming to be in the process of being, again here in Mad Men, divided up. And someone of course in the middle in this case as well, Bobby.
Since this era is seen as a divided time....greater metaphor going on here?
I admire this woman now more than ever. First, she's informed that hubby Greg "has no brains in his fingers" Harris will NOT receive the antcipated residency....that she will have to keep working. This comes as no real surprise to the rest of us, but Joan bore the bad news. She appears so cool and calm as the Brits descend upon SC, on what is to be her last day at work. The pressure must have been unimaginable! Yet her greatest moment takes place on the floor, drenched in blood, attending to Guy's nearly severed ankle and had to give orders to boot!! THEN SHE GOES TO THE HOSPITAL WITH HIM!! She reminded me of Jackie K. at that point (although not as dire....but still). Finally, she jokes with Don and leaves the hospital in her bloody green dress, swinging her shopping bag. Joan is a true goddess. When will she be crowned Queen??
Hi everyone,
I can't stop worrying about Joan. I think she's starting to grasp that she made a mammoth mistake, marrying Greg (gee Joan, ya think? The whole engagement started on a bad note, with him sexually assaulting you in Don's office!), and I think that Joan wanted to say something to Don, while they were in the waiting room. They shared an amazing moment together, and I haven't seen Don laugh that hard, at Joan's fantastic quip of, "One moment you're on top of the world. The next, a secretary runs over your foot with a lawnmower," since Roger's quips he was making in the elevator, as they were on their way to the underground casino. The way Joan looked at Don, and he looked at her-the respect and love came blaring from my TV. I had a good cry at that moment, as I can't believe she may be leaving the show. The chemistry Joan has with everyone at Sterling Cooper is too important.
What will Joan do? Your predictions please, everyone!
She obviously doesn't get the show , Hated what she did to Jon and Jan !
Here, in no particular order, is a list of things I loved in this week's episode:
1. Bobby Draper. He's turning out to be a nice little boy ( "Can I pet him?" he says to Betty in reference to Baby Gene) and he's a sound sleeper -- screaming sister, barking dog and fighting parents -- do not stand in his way of a good night's sleep. Also loved that he was shown wearing a dirty shirt in the scene with Betty and Baby Gene -- just seemed very "real" to me.
2. The Dr Pepper soda machine in the hospital waiting room. Love the door that you opened to get your drink. We had a machine like that in the laundry room of the apartment house I lived in as a child in the '60s.
3. Betty's dress with the strawberries and the green rickrack in the scene where she gives the Barbie to Sally.
4. Pete sticking his foot (no pun intended) in his mouth when greeted by Guy McKendrick. After McKendrick compliments Pete on his accomplishments, Pete says "I wish I could say the same thing about you."
5. Don's "get out of my way you little twerp" look at John Hooker when Don walks into the lobby and Hooker is announcing the impending PP&L visit.
6. Roger, Roger, Roger. Back in rare form. "I'm being punished for making my job look so easy." Plus his recounting of his father's well manicured hand in the casket.
7. The transition of Lane Pryce's facial and body expressions from the time he first gets the box (a pleased "Oh, you shouldn't have" look) to his discovery of the stuffed snake in the box to the realization that he will have to go home and explain to Rebecca that they're moving to Bombay.
8. Mr. Ford of PP&L: a dead ringer for James Mason in voice, and almost in looks.
9. That Don survived a stressful day without breaking a sweat: passed over for what he thought was a promotion to London, an unexpected meeting with Conrad Hilton that could turn into big business, a visit to the hospital after an in-office lawn mower accident , discovery of Sally's Barbie face down in the bushes and then restoring order to a household that includes a crying baby, screaming child, barking dog and a wife who refuses to budge on the issue of naming their new child after a man who hated him. Jack Bauer on "24" has nothing on our man Mr. Draper.
10. Last but certainly not least, our dear Joan.
8.
7.
I don't know, and I'll probably be publicly flogged, but I'm really worried that Lois on her John Deere tractor has become MM's version of Fonzie on his waterskis. Anybody else think so, or am I completely alone on this?
I'm having trouble keeping track of them all since Mad Men began. Anybody care to suggest a few?
Last night we were treated to Charles Dickens and Mark Twain, and what a comparison! Both authors were known as true representatives of a national literature. Lane Pryce tells Don that he's been reading American lit--Tom Sawyer-- and that he feels like he's witnessed his own funeral, but didn't like the eulogy. (Tom attended his own funeral when the townsfolk thought he was dead.)
Joan offers the PPL visitors tickets to the Broadway show "Oliver!" which was a smash hit in NY in 1963. The irony is that it was a hit in London in 1961, and was written by one of England's most celebrated novelists, and adapted by a London Cockney, who also wrote all the songs-- Lionel Bart.
"A tragedy with a happy ending." Indeed!
Both novels feature orphans who land on their feet. Not a coincidence on Mad Men, I'm certain.
I am curious what others think about the references to light in this episode--Sally's nightlight, the scene of Don staring at the ceiling light. Last week's episode was about the characters being, in one way or another, in a fog. What, if anything, has been illuminated?
Song To Woody
I'm out here a thousand miles from my home,
Walkin' a road other men have gone down.
I'm seein' your world of people and things,
Your paupers and peasants and princes and kings.
Hey, hey Woody Guthrie, I wrote you a song
'Bout a funny ol' world that's a-comin' along.
Seems sick an' it's hungry, it's tired an' it's torn,
It looks like it's a-dyin' an' it's hardly been born.
Hey, Woody Guthrie, but I know that you know
All the things that I'm a-sayin' an' a-many times more.
I'm a-singin' you the song, but I can't sing enough,
'Cause there's not many men that done the things that you've done.
Here's to Cisco an' Sonny an' Leadbelly too,
An' to all the good people that traveled with you.
Here's to the hearts and the hands of the men
That come with the dust and are gone with the wind.
I'm a-leaving' tomorrow, but I could leave today,
Somewhere down the road someday.
The very last thing that I'd want to do
Is to say I've been hittin' some hard travelin' too.
Copyright ©1962; renewed 1990 MCA
Here's a link to the TIME magazine article on Connie: http://www.time.com/time/magazine/article/0,9171,896912,00.html
Interesting excerpt:
As the force that created this empire, Conrad Hilton might be expected to be as calculating, as antiseptic and as glossily sophisticated as his hotels. The surprise about Hilton is that he is so much like the guests he caters to. Boyish, candid, trusting, he never fails to be amazed and pleased--even astonished--by the world around him. He cannot get over the speed of jet planes or his possession of a $100 Texas-style Stetson, whose price he mentions to anyone who will listen. He is susceptible to even the most transparent flattery. "You know," he says, "after the Rotterdam opening, the president of the corporation that owns the hotel came up to me and said, 'Your dance was the greatest thing that happened here.' That touched me most." When something impresses him, he often slaps his knee and exclaims: "By golly!"
Hilton refuses to comprehend bad news or business reversals ("Don't bother me about that," he says), and his top aides instinctively try to protect him from the harsh realities of the world. Says one: "For all his financial genius, he's the kind of man who can't catch a plane by himself." He is essentially a lonely man, and his closest friend is neither a businessman nor one of his four children, but his personal secretary for 21 years, Olive Wakeman, fiftyish, who acts as his chief buffer against the outside world. "I've got to protect him," she says. "He's the most naive man for his experience I've ever seen; he will not believe that anyone would tell an untruth."
Just about every episode this season has ended with Don at home with his family. In the past three episodes we've had Sally alone, after Gene's death. Then we have Don and Sally after baby Gene's birth, and most recent we have Don, Sally, and baby Gene, together for the first time.
I know there are alot of Betty haters out there, but I feel like this family is slowly finding one another, finding it's way back together and learning that it's easier to heal as a unit, then to try and do it alone.
Any predictions as to whether Betts and Bobby will be joining the party any time soon? And what needs to happen to make it so?
poor Guy - he walks into the agency but not out! Hee Hee Hee :-)
Could it be Jackie Kennedy coming to the aid of John Kennedy in the motorcade ? The blood on the dress etc.
Well, well, well. Looks like our favorite secretary will be polishing up her resume. Any suggestions for her next career choice?
Last week Thirteen posted a great thread, "A Smear of Blood?" This week we had more bloodshed and in even a more violent way (Matt Weiner's Sopranos background has infiltrated). I posted on that thread that I felt that all this blood is foreshadowing, (and building up to, among other things figuratively) but most significantly, and literally, the assassination of JFK. There is no stopping this now and I can only imagine what else is to come in the next episodes. This escalation feels very operatic and all the other subplots may start to feel less significant as this steamroller builds. Any thoughts?
a review on this Emmy-winning night
I thought it was Don, but PixilDust said it could be Dr. Rapist. Easy for Joan to go back to SC if Greg is DEAD.
It's showing 105 replies but when I click on the thread to post, I see only 42 comments. What gives?
All in all it looks like this board is stalled. I'm also getting "your reply is being held for moderator approval" type of response when I try to post...either that or the board crashes completely.
When SC most famous red head leaves for 'greener pastures' they literally paint the office red! LMAO
My personal favorite: "They say he'll never golf again..."
Talk about Season 3, Episode 5, "The Fog."
http://www.associatedcontent.com/article/2135743/ladies_how_to_create_a_retro_mad_men.html?cat=46
Here's a link: http://www.lohud.com/article/20090920/ENTERTAINMENT/909200301/-1/SPORTS/Mad%20Men+:%20Westchester%20Watch
Yeah! It's Sunday again - what do I watch - 'A Guy Walks Into an Advertising Agency' or do I watch MM clean house at the Emmy's???
Congrats to my fellow Casting Call finalists. Does anyone know who took the cake, or when the winner will be announced?
Chion Wolf's quote: "At the beginning of Season One, when the show first started, when I would think of women in the 60's -- and they would be spoken down to -- I just imagined: 'well, they probably rolled their eyes about it' --you know, they knew they weren't as low class - or less than they were implied to be...BUT THEN I REALIZED THAT SOME WOMEN REALLY BELIEVED IT [my emphasis]. I didn't realize that until I saw the show -- some women really believed they were below men...." (Quote is from WNPR's Colin McEnroe Show recently, featuring Chion's brother, Michael Gladis,as guest.
In a previous epi, Pete states "...your decisions affect me". Any predictions about Pete and Peggy???
I just watched the sneak peek of episode 6, and I found it kind of amusing that the top execs from the British company are arriving on July 2nd according to Pryce. He said they would also be at SC on July 3rd. And, he was sorry, "they didn't know it was a holiday"?!!!
OK, was that a joke, or British payback for Americans winning our freedom from the British, and celebrating it on July 4th?
I just found it funny.
Also, was it me, or does that Hooker guy seem like one of those people who announce Royal proclaimations? Are they called pages?
All I know is the Beatles better get here soon!!
http://www.ethiopianreview.com/scitech/10218
Both posters Joneiric and Tere have mentioned Virgina Woolf's novel To the Lighthouse as a basis for the reference to the Hebrides made by the nurse during Betty's labor in episode 5. I thought I would put up this topic to see what other thought about the episode's connection to the novel.
The novel begins before WWI and ends after it, and between the first and last section of the novel is the part entitled "Time Passes," in which, interestingly, one of the Ramsey daughter's dies in childbirth.
Mrs. Ramsey is the quintessential mother figure who also dies in the "Time Passes" section, leaving her family to pick up the pieces left by her death in the last part, "The Lighthouse." The fact that the line about the Hebrides is spoken to Betty as she begins her dream, and as something she will study in school,
suggests the child to adult shift that Betty makes during this episode. She must pick up the pieces left by her father's death and, with this death, enter fully into adulthood.
Many of the posters in the open thread have commented on the precursors this season to the social change and upheaval of the later part of the 60's. Does an indirect allusion to this novel connect with the theme of change? Society after WWI was dramatically different than before, just as society by the ends of the 60's had been radically altered by the Vietnam war, the civil rights movement, and the sexual revolution.
Why is there no Season 3 update of Cast & Characters? This omission seems to be a cyclical rebuke from the producers to viewers!
I am wondering about what the nurse said to Betty just after she put her IV in. She said.."Relax you are at 5 cm, that's half way from here to the Heberdese and other mountain ranges which we are currently studying in Chapter 12." I do not know what that meant or if maybe Betty is hallucinating. Any thoughts?
finish this sentence
Pryce said Don's expense account was $70.00, Sal's was $82.00.
I'm guessing he bought extra pens, pencils, and paper!
"Pencils, pens, pads, paper and postage"
"Pennies make pounds and pounds make profits"
I found this almost comical that he kept using the letter P when talking. Does he just like to hear himself talk or is there something behind him using words that start with P?
Nope, not garters for nylons. Not wedding garters. In episode 4 I noticed Gene was wearing old-fashioned garters, the kind men wore in the '20s and '30s to hold up their socks. Kind of endearing, actually. I apologize if this has already been mentioned ten dozen times, but if it has, I didn't see it...
If I could choose one song for Mad Man to play from the top hits of 1963 surely it would be Nat King Cole singing "That Sunday, That Summer." I don't think it's possible not to smile while listening to it.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1oHiljdikCk
What song from 1963 would you like to hear played somewhere during the show?
Just remembering Mary Travers of Peter, Paul and Mary, who died today. Beautiful voice, beautiful spirit.
we see on the birth certificate Betty's named her new son Eugene Scott Draper. How does the Scott fit in?
Was that Gene's middle name also. I know it doesn't come from Don in any way because his real life is a secret.
Also, though not conscious on her part Betty, has left an open wound for Don for him to deal with by naming the baby Gene since Gene didn't like Don.
Why did Betty fire Carla? How will she cope without her?
Monday's episode of Oprah is about going back to the 60's, and Jon Hamm & January Jones will be on!
I took this test twice over a three week period. I didn't memorize my answers. I was hoping for a different result the second time, but both times I was Joan Holloway. It didn't do much for my male ego. Of course I wanted to be Roger or Don. Anyone else care to take the test and share the result. it is easy to find the game, just go to MadMen main.
1. They were off the mark when that baby was born. Newborns of that era did not have a knit cap slapped on their heads while in the hospital. Back then, the only time a hat was put on infants was when they were taken outside.
2. That remark about selling to African Americans in Detroit was out of line. True, Detroit is thought to be a primarily black city today. But the era of the program is before Detroit's 1967 race riots when white flight began and before the mass migration of Southern blacks to the Northern industries.
Link in the comments. Taking bets on how long until Sally's teacher goes truly feral and dances around Don's maypole...
First, where are these men coming from?
Pete, see, here's a guy who wants to sell TVs to Negroes. This guy in the elevator, he's one of those Negroes, so what brand does he have and why? And Hollis is being cagey and won't tell Pete anything. "Get in trouble," what the hell, we're just talking about television for chrissake! Everyone wants a house, car, TV, and all that; why won't he tell me how he chose his TV? Pete knows he's being lied to, but he can't figure out why.
Hollis cannot still have his job and be as unaware of protocol as Pete is. Hollis's main goal is to keep his job. If he angers Pete, or angers anyone on his elevator, enough to get complained about, his boss will do one of two things: (1) ask Hollis into his office, describe the complaint, and get his side of it, or (2) get the keys from Hollis and tell him not to come back. Hollis knows how to behave: he's softspoken, polite, neutral. "How about this rain, Hollis." "It's sure bad out there, sir." Nope, no good - what if the man's father was a farmer and he likes the rain? Better something like, "It sure is coming down, sir." Keep it neutral, and short.
So, poor, poor Pete, scares the hell out of Hollis. He probably doesn't much like Pete anyway - you have to know Pete for a little while before you can start to like him. Evers is, of course, on Hollis's mind, just as he is absent from Pete's mind. Pete wants the last thing that Hollis can give him: a definite opinion on something, something Pete really cares about. That way lies unemployment. (When he tells Pete that he doesn't want to get into trouble, he may also be thinking that Pete's stopped the elevator, and he doesn't want to get back to the lobby to the welcoming cries of "Where the hell you been, boy?")
Hollis's mind is surely racing during this exchange. Ralph Ellison's invisible man goes through such narrated convulsions which cannot fail to impress the visible reader.
The laugh at the end of their conversation comes from Pete catching Hollis in an obvious lie, and Hollis feeling less tense since Pete's given up and about to leave the elevator. And Hollis can see that Pete means no harm, not that that implies to Hollis that he was wrong to feel threatened.
This may be the most complicated clash of intent and perception in Mad Men to date. If I get this DVD and La Monde Byrd isn't on the 2nd commentary track, I'm sending it back!
After watching the show for the third time, I realized that the shadows on Betty's back as she walks towards the baby's room look like prison bars. My initial thoughts were this is Betty's prison, but then I recalled her going out in her peignoir set (that's what they called them in the 60's) with the cigarette in her mouth shooting the pigeons in Season 1. Betty's is the bird in the cage? Any thoughts?
Just posted on Racys Kennedy thread. Of course that was a big day everyone of a certain age remembers. I would be curious to know what the Top 5 National or Celebrity tragedies you can remember
I was listening to some Bob Dylan recordings and found this great song on Bob Dylan's 1964 "The Times They Are a-Changin' album.
He performed the song on June 16,1963 at The Newport Folk Festival.
How appropriate for what we have been seeing on MM.
The song is called: "Only a Pawn In Their Game"
A bullet from the back of a bush took Medgar Evers' blood
A finger fired the trigger to his name
A handle hid out in the dark
A hand set the spark
Two eyes took the aim
Behind a man's brain
But he can't be blamed
He's only a pawn in their game
A south politician preaches to thr poor white man
"You got more than the blacks, don't complain
You're better than them
You have been born with white skin," they explain
And the negro's name is used, it is plain
For the politicians gain as he rises to fame
And the poor white remains on the caboose of the train
But it ain't him to blame, he's only a pawn in their game
The deputy sheriffs, the sldiers, the governors get paid
And the marshals and cops get the same
But the poor white man's
Used in the hands of them all like a tool
He's taught in his school from the start by the rule
That the laws are with him to protect his white skin
To keep up his hate so he never thinks straight
'Bout the shape that he's in, but it ain't him to blame
He's only a pawn in their game
From the poverty shacks he looks from the cracks to the tracks
And he's taught how to walk in a pack
Shoot in the back with his fist in a clinch
To hang and to lynch, to hide "neath the hood
To kill with no pain like a dog on a chain
He ain't got no name but it ain't hime to blame
He's only a pawn in their game
Today Medgar Evers was buried from the bullet he caught
They lowered him down as a king
But when the shadowy sun sets on the one
That fired the gun
He'll see by his grave
On the stine that remains
Carved next to his name, his epitaph plain
Only a pawn in their game
Saint John Powell is among the PP&L Brits showing up in the 3:06 episode. Just saw it listed under Charles Shaughnessy's (sp?) appearances.
Starting a separate thread for this so as to not disturb the real episode thread that is ONLY for talk about the show. This is only for predictions of how the show will open in the very first scene. No prizes except "Fame & Fortune" on the MadMen blog, and superiority above your peers on here, both the ones you love, and love to hate! All kidding aside, just a fun contest, join in!
In "The Fog," do you think the caterpillar symbolizes anything? Or was it just another one of Betty's drugged out dreams? Poor Betty, so glad the birthing process is different today!
Ok.. so whats with Betts attitude lately? She is well aware the Don is a lying cheat and now she will have the worst Post Partum Depression, the passing of her father tipped the scales for her!
Okay on a lighter note, who wants to speculate on what happened to the missing credenza that came up during the paper clips and pencils meeting?
They have all these people submitting entries for the contest.....doing free marketing for the show by telling their friends and family to come to the website and vote. Please fix this problem!
:-D 60's Child posted another thread on this, but this darn forum tends to bury the older threads, so I thought I'd better "bump" the topic with a fresh post.
Paul mentions Marxist economics in passing, and Paul being Paul it's just erudite posturing ("See how smart I am..."). But if you look back at the episode there's some interesting hints that the ruling class in the 60's is about to run into trouble, and they really should read Marx to know why.
Peggy puts it succinctly when she says to Don, "You have everything, and so much of it!" This is Marxist economic theory at it's simplest. No one should have all when so many don't have enough. Why, if SC is trimming expenses, are they going after pencils rather than upper management's perks? Why is it that a hard worker like Peggy can barely afford to live on the salary she's paid? And why is she being paid less for the same work done by her male counterparts? Why should the youngest child always get hand-me-downs and never anything new? And what about Pete's discussion with the TV guys about racial economic inequality?
There's some interesting discussions in this episode about redistribution of wealth, and the revolutions you foment by not giving people their fair share. Especially when you display the American dream in advertisements, but make sure that only an elite few ever get it, "and so much of it," too.
1. More of Joannie and Dr. Evil. Maybe they'll have a big argument and she'll call him out for out not telling her about his problems at the hospital. I'm scared to see what will come of it, but we need to see where they stand
2. Peggy continuing to push for higher status at SC, and shoving Paul the Poseur to the side as she does so. Maybe she'll make a splash with the Bacardi campaign.
3. Betty actually being motherly! Hopefully she'll find some happiness in the new baby. I don't know if I can stand to see her going through post-partum depression.
4. Roger realizing that the grass is not greener with his new wife - that honeymoon cannot last forever!
5. As I wished for last week, I'd like to see some character development with Ken. He has about as much personality as Barbie doll's plastic mate.
Episode 5 was pretty great, but what else would like to see next week?
Will there be a new Mad Men this week, conflicting with the Emmy's, or are they taking a week off, like last year?
Betty's yellow sweater was bought at Swift(my little boutique)! Visit if you're in L.A.. Can't wait to see other picks on future episodes...i'll keep us posted. http://www/iloveswift.com
with all the tensions at SC this season, perhaps some R&R would be helpful. Who would you want to go on vacation with and where would you go?
I worry most about Harry and feel that he'd do well to get away and really think deeply about what he wants to accomplish . He somehow got himself a plum position but he's not makeing much of it. He seems to confide in his fatherinlaw but I'd like him to start thinking on his feet.. Where would be a destination that would spur him on? .
I can't stop looking at the large painting in Don's office and the one in the conference room. Even when Don's in the room! Does anyone know the name of the artist's who painted them?
Here is this week's list, in no particular order, of things I loved in Episode 5:
1. The handwriting charts in Ms. Farrell's classroom, above the blackboard. I believe it was called the Palmer Method. I remember penmanship class when I was in grade school. Do they still teach that?
2. Betty's lemon yellow dress in the scene with the teacher, and Francine's lemon yellow pants. Seems like lemon yellow was a much more popular spring/summer color for fashion in the '60s.
3. The return of Francine. Hallelujah! Every line delivered with just the right amount of snarky deliciousness.
4. Peggy delivering the baby present to Don. "You didn't have to do that.... Yes, I did, I didn't know everyone else was going in on a gift." Coupled with: "Don't return it .. I was the youngest and I never got anything new."
5. The return of Duck Phillips (and his ducks). Love the turtleneck. Also love the line to Pete: "Have a nosh."
6. Pete to Duck: "You're at Grey two months and already you're noshing?"
7. Pete's misguided attempt to conduct a focus group on Hollis in the elevator. Question: "Why'd you buy it? [the tv] Answer: "To watch tv."
8. Betty's technicolor dream rudely and loudly interrupted by Don, the prison guard and the candy striper trying to get cigarettes out of the machine in the waiting room.
9. Don grabbing his hat when Betty announces "It's time."
10. The nurse to Betty: "Just breathe and think of the beauty parlor."
There is a GREAT segment on NPR about Bacardi... they go alittle into the advertising as well. Time for a mojito!!!
http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=94320922
Life imitates art imitates life imitates art.
http://www.nypost.com:80/p/entertainment/tv/grey_advertising_films_mad_men_parody_98BTXpfIgOl2ibuMGBauHM
Last episode during the ant farm calamity, Pryce doesn't throw a fit, he actually laughs along with the guys. Not what we'd think.
Right before that he walked in while the guys were discussing jai alai, and he says, "Look at this, comaraderie, perhaps we've found America's new past time". Is he talking not of jai alai but of comaraderie being America's past time (in that Brit tongue and cheek subtle sarcastic kind of dry wit) ?
So this episode Don says something like I can't talk to you when you're this way and pours a drink. And here Pryce doesn't put his hand over Don's drink and say no. He accepts it, and even in his own novice way, takes a sip.
The first episode they were drinking tea. Also Pryce even had a little empathy for the Americans in firing 1/3 of the work force.
There may be something to this Pryce..
Thoughts as to why the Prison guard ignored Don as he passed him in the hospital hallway while pushing his wife in the wheel chair ?
Check out this auction on eBay for my old stove: http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=290350080314&ssPageName=STRK:MESELX:IT. Sorry for this self-serving post. This is just like the stove in the old b&w episodes of Bewitched.
I'm thinking the mopping of the blood as kind of a Dickens/Ghost of Betty's (immediate) future type of thing. She had the choice to continue this direction (The illusion has a lot of components, and I had felt part of the illusion sequence was about Betty having a choice, and it was looking rather grim as to what direction she may choose). And she saw a symbol of what lies directly ahead, a visual of what the result is, if she decides to go in that direction.
So she made her choice, as right after is when we see her suddenly with baby.
What do you make of the smears of blood throughout the episode? There's the blood from the fight that we briefly see Sally smear on her face, the smear of blood on the floor that Betty sees her father mopping up in the dream (blood from Evans assassination?). And though it's not quite about blood, there is that odd moment when Don holds up the egg and is told by Sally that if he sees veins, he only needs to shake the egg and it will be fine.
Thoughts?
I see that Roger and Don's friendship has really changed since last season. Instead of dropping by Don's office, he called him regarding the Art dept. I guess he can't stand being in the same room with Don for too long. And the way he chided him on his son's birth when he only took half a day from work to be with Betty and his new baby. Roger is so jealous of Don that he bought himself a new wife so he can fell like he's Don's equal. Roger should be over his mid life crisis by now. How long is this going to last. Also, everyone seems to think that Don has it all even Peggy. From the outside looking in, he does. But all of these characters envy Don so much fronm Roger, Pete, Peggy and probably many more yet Don is just as unhappy as they are. These characters are so busy looking at what someone else has that they can't see thatthey have just as much as Don. Pete has his family legacy that Don in a way once envied being raised in a privileged world. Remember his conversation with the gentleman at Roger's partyand peeing in rich people's cars. Peggy has her new career than Joan secretly envies but doesn't know how to speak up. Joan has her new marriage, although a bad one, that many of the secretaries think is a pot of gold. Pete envies Don for evertything that he has. It jsut seems that noone on th eshow is happy. I keep thinking about what Gene said, "You people think that money is the answer to everything" Everyone on the show seem to want money and status. I wonder if Don will end up leaving SC and take Sal, Pete, Peggy with him. Let's be real, the entire company would follow Don. He's like the glue that holds that company together. Roger had better tread carefully.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_p6JgqfmYu4&feature=PlayList&p=B16C313C00A263FC&index=0&playnext=1
One of the many things I notice we MadMen fans love about this series is the sense of 60's style, that has been recreated spot-on, from furniture, to accessories, cars, clothing, etc. If you're a fan of vintage clothing in general, you really should check out the website and blog for Helen Uffner Vintage Clothing (they have clothes from the 1860's-1970's). This is the biggest vintage costume company in New York City, and, they have been dressing films, theater and TV in real vintage clothing for over 30 years! Their blog is fun and full of juicy into about their period productions and even history lessons on vintage topics. The even provided clothes in 2008 for a MadMen TV promotion for the upcoming season, as well as the clothes for the SNL MadMen skit, when Jon Hamm hosted. The good news: If you're a collector, they just announced on their FaceBook Fan Page (I am a fan, of course!), that they will soon be selling fun vintage stuff on the internet in the near future! Enjoy!
http://uffnervintage.com/
Or, rather, her visions while on drugs and having a baby. Including her walk down the sidewalk in the beautiful summer dress where she captures a caterpillar dangling from a tree, her vision of her father mopping blood off the floor, of her mother with Evans, barefoot walk down the hospital hallways, etc.
What did you think of them and what messages did they get across to you?
I can't believe all the references to feet in this program! Here are those I've noticed:
Bert Cooper makes everyone (excepting Alice) remove their shoes before entering his office. He walks the halls at SC in stockinged feet, which are shown several times. He steps on a wad of bubble gum and fires a secretary in an abusive rage.
Sally admires Betty's riding boots, and tries them on. Later, Betty gives her a pair of her own.
Betty, out of the blue, comments that she "hates" her feet. Sally says she loves them.
Betty steps on a wine glass left on the bedroom floor. We see her picking the pieces out of her sole. (Soul?)
Don's footprints leading to the Pacific ocean are shown before we see him go into the water.
Don focuses on the teacher's bare feet while she is dancing in the Maypole celebration.
Don tells the stewardess "forget your shoes" when the fire alarm sounds at their hotel.
Betty's bare feet are shown as she dreams that she's walking down the hospital corridor.
Even one of the DVD discs has a picture of some lovely green fabric-covered pumps.
WHAT GIVES??
I am amazed that we haven't had more discussion about the race issues that were weaved through last nights' episode so heavily. Carlas leaving, the Admiral TV stats, the copies of Ebony and Jet, the newspaper (I believe from Harlem), Hollis, the MLK reference, the death of Medgar Evans. I think the writers are getting us ready for the big changes to come.
Was the MLK "I have a dream" speech and march on Washington in July or August of 1963?
Don gave a drink to Lane, who took one gulp and handed it back. Don gave a drink to Peggy who basically did the same. Is this one of the many things that's changing? Heck with tracking the expense of pencils and paper - how about the booze???
Karen Erickson / McCann Erickson
What's with the name reuse? Was Dennis Hobart a real person or is he just a made up character? One never knows on this show.
i just watched the scene with don passing by dennis and his wife in the corridor again. before dennis notices don coming r he and his wife are smiling. mother and baby must both be doing fine. i don't get the look he gives don. is he embarrassed by what he said in the father's room?
That I don't have to give birth in the 1960's.
That looked like the most horrible experience in child birth EVER!
Not having your husband there
Twilight sleep
Held down by the nurse
"Either you get the baby out or we will"
Screaming for her husband but all alone
Drugs, drugs, and more drugs
Waking up with a baby in your arms and not knowing that it was even a boy... or even that it was born
Your other children standing on the sidewalk downstairs to see you
I just sat here and thought... thank G-d for medical advances and more progressive thinking!
I didn't peg Weiner for a balletomane but I assume there was some reason he decided to give her that name...
The real Suzanne Farrell is a very famous ballet dancer who was with the New York City Ballet during the MM era, starting in 1961.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Suzanne_Farrell
Any thoughts on the name Scott? Do you think Betty picked it because she seems to be an F.Scott Fitzgerald fan?
Sorry for the other post...haven't had enough coffee yet.
Boy, I've heard that term so much lately...does history repeat itself?
I know a large portion of the regulars here are Pegaholics. I would love to see her go. The dynamics are dynamic. oh I think I have a slogan. Anyhow I am not trying to get rid of her. The possibilities of it happening are intriguing. And she can always come back after Duck's scheme inevitably falls apart. Glad to see Duck back. He is such a silk covered , big dreaming,backstabbing sleazebag. All in the costume of extreme civility. So much like so many buisness people.Only taken to an extreme. Will Peggy come back, hat in hand. Will she come back to and get a raise? or after seeing Roger wave Good-bye Don will he leave and take Peggy and Pete and screw Duck again,mmmmmmcould be
Here's some other little things upon 2nd and 3rd re-airing that you catch. Betty is gonna be a heavy subject this episode so here's some of those other things that make Mad Men, Mad Men that you probably caught but were lost in the open thread. Apologies for any repeats.
Did you catch how Pryce actually had a drink with Don, but he sipped it; Don completely downed the whole thing in one gulp.
When Betty is first in the wheelchair, she looks back at Don and as someone crosses the path, Don literally disappears. You saw that so that's not the point. She had said to Don at Roger's party "don't disappear" when Don left Roger's show.
The weird guard there with Don finally says, "I'm gonna be a new man". That's both Don's theme in general, yet Betty's theme too here. It looked like Betty had a choice and chose yes. She's gonna be a new person. (But just like Don, we'll see)
When Don bonds with Sally in the kitchen, the opening shot, don't tell me you didn't think it wasn't going right back to the opening sequence of episode 1 this year. Visually almost same thing.
When Peggy comes to Don in the end and gives him the present she says she didn't know everyone was going in on gifts; again she's in the cold.
Fun with language: Sally asking Don, "Are you looking for a chick?"
Pete and Peggy with Duck: "Are we supposed to go together?"
More barefoot freedom, this time with Betty walking through the hospital. She even caresses her fingers on the wall. Not in exact accordance with Don and the grass, but still, she now did it too...
