I think Duck's had a petit mal seizure. See how unresponsive he was and how he became incontinent? To my knowledge, that's what happens during a petit mal seizure.
Who is the boxer? Floyd? (I don't follow the sport...). Why was Jimmy there? Just poetic license? I love hearing Freddy's history from WWII. Makes me appreciate him a lot more.
I like the parallel - Dick pissed his pants and got a new identity. Freddy did the same and lost his.
I am an R.N. that worked on the Red Cross Blood Mobile for many years. Don is right, many people [not just women] faint.Sometimes they go out completly and do become incontinent.That happens while they are giving blood not later so not sure what the whole thing with Freddie was about but I assume he gave blood.
must correct above comment, a person can still pass out later and become incontinent, but not in the situation Freddy was in. I watch this during central time and didn't get started till late so I have some catching up to do. I apologize if everything I just said makes no scenes later. Boy is Betty ever depressed. Classic.
Whoa! I was dumbfounded and completely entranced by this week's episode.
I loved the look on Don's face when he got the shopping bag of shirts from Menkin's.
One question: When Mona shouted, "you can talk to Margaret!" Whom did she mean? I had the idea that Jane moved her way up horizontally to Roger's heart...
I guess now we know why Jane was dressed so conservatively...Now that she hooked into Roger, she only shows skin for him. Speak about 'hide in plain sight'.
I thought it was interesting that the African-American elevator worker - the guy they usually say one word to then ignore and never treat as a peer - was the one to say "some people hide in plain sight."
I love how the actress who plays Carla portrays her conflict of having to be a doting housewife, all the while silently acknowledging that there is chaos in the Draper household. I remember a few episodes back when Don offers her a ride home, she wants no part of the Draper's drama to come to her private life. I totally understand that one, sister!
Meanwhile, I don't really get why Bets would skip out on the lunch date. Had she wanted to give her friend the pleasure of seeking excitement through an affair? Why is she staying at home then?
Who is Margaret? I thought that was Roger's daughter's name. What did Mona mean by that. Roger in love with his secretary, Jane? I thought that was Don's secretary.
Martini Up: you are so right. pete does look like pee wee herman. i have thought all this time he looked like someone but couldnt put my finger on it. so, did don fire jane because roger seemed to get friendly with her after mona left by putting his hand on her shoulder or because she didnt stop mona from barging in his office? do you think that the news about marilyn monroe's suicide is leading into freddy committing suicide? he did say if he doesnt go to work on monday, what am i? just a thought.
I love love love watching Betty defrost the fridge using a bowl of hot water, and then cutting drawer liner papers--- reminds me of my childhood, watching my mother do her kitchen upkeep.
I imagine Margaret will be Mona's lawyer. As to Jane...I mentioned in a previous post about Joan and Jane that being the boss's girlfriend is a powerful position in an office, as least in the offices I have worked in. I can't imagine however that the current story arc that has Joan on her way out won't turn somehow. She is too important a character in my view. I love the professional bond between Don and Peggy.
Lots of lounging on couches going on with this episode: Joan on Roger's couch, Betty on her couch when the doorbell rang, Pete on his couch, and even ol' Don on his. Gotta get a couch for my office....
Clearly, Don did not want to sully his hands with a homewrecker like Jane. Remember that he's trying to act like he didn't have an affair, even when confronted about it playfully by both Roger (this ep.) and also Bobbie (two eps. back).
Betty is living vicariously through Sara Beth. She's not ready to have an affair just yet, but she's taking baby steps by setting her friend up for one.
I liked how she took the phone off the hook while they prepared their cookie dough lunch. Nice touch.
Isn't Margaret Roger's daughter? And those shirts from Menkins...Do you think Rachel helped picked them out knowing they were for Don? Or did she just give a store discount for old times? LOL
I think Mona just meant to say to Roger that he can tell their daughter, Margaret, that he is leaving Mona after 25 years of marriage for a girl about Margaret's own age. (Sorry if the grammar was off there.)
Roger is schtupping Jane. Don wants her off the desk because he doesn't want to be part of it. Jane got emotional because it all came out right in front of everyone.
Remember, Joan told her she knew exactly what was going on after Jane went to Roger and kept her job.
Freddie is moving into an advanced stage of alcoholism.
Like they say, "Denial is a river in Egypt."
And it looks like Betty is hitting the wine bottle a bit more, now, as well.
Booze, the great escape. Until it bites you in the butt.
Why did Jane buy Don some shirts? At first I thought she might be flirting with him. But now, after learning she is having an affair with Sterling, I don't think that.
The episode is soooo good; January Jones is a fantastic actress because she has allowed me to totally despise the character of Bette as a mother, wonder about her as a woman, and feel a bit sorry for her a wife.
Re: her inability to nurture her children...every time i see bette interact with her children i think about the lyric in the Janis Ian song of the late 60s.."I leaving home after living alone for so many years"...she is the typical privileged suburban housewife who can afford to indulge her psychic pain by sleeping late and ignoring/berating her children. I can just see Sally and Bobbie being disaffected teens who choose to run to Haight-Asbury and tune in, turn on and drop out with lots of drugs and sex cause mom didn't have the time to put the world in perspective for them when they were much younger and made them pay for the indiscretions of their dad....
.... Oh Freddie Rumson....that scene in his office was a classic...he has been messing up for quite a while and this is the straw yada yada yada...I am sure that he was the best years ago but he has allowed alochol to ruin all his best instincts and talents...great that Don was so loyal..which brings me to another point. While we all know that Don is a big 'ho" I also know that Don an amazing set of principals that don't ever seem to be reflected in the general population of S/C...he is extremely supportive of his creative team and especially Peggy (support he gave her when she was in the hospital and the opportuity he created for her when he and Rumson noticed her talent as a copy writer and even slapping Roger when he as incanting another woman's name after his heart attack...his attempts to connect solidly with his children and even his support of Bette when she was quite less than a helpmate last season...I also remember a small scene in the elevator when he made those young men change their tone and conversation and take off their hats....
.....it also looks as if Pete is getting on Peggy's last nerve with his selfish egotism and that finally, we will get to see Carla and the elevator operator as people rather than props in another world...
...all i have to say for now
I LOVE Jane's dress with the colored squares in comparison to Betty's dress with the colored polka-dots. Jane's affair with the boss is bold, point-blank, cut and dried and ends up out in the open. Don's affairs are mixed up, a myriad of women and meeting places and are well hidden from his child-like wife. These visual expressions couldn't be any better.
Roger is having an affair - and thinks he's in love - with Jane. Mona's comment about Margaret meant that Roger will have to tell their daughter what is going on - she (Mona) is not going to be the dutiful enabler anymore - that Roger is going to have to be a grown up and and take responsibility for this one with his little girl (now 18?) who thinks he's perfect.
Don is firing Jane because OBVIOUSLY Jane and Roger were talking about him.
I agree with Born in 1960 - Yes, Betty is living through her friend (by setting her up to have an affair) because she isn't ready to have one herself, yet.
And how about when Don said "Good Night" to Freddie. And Freddie answered, "Good Bye". I think that says a lot. Freddie knows he won't be coming back.
Well, I am new to the whole Mad Men craze, and I have to say that I am officially in love with this show now. I tried to catch up with the marathon that they showed last week. So, I will be watching it from now on. And I liked this week's episode, especially when Don punched that Barrett guy in the face at the underground casino.
GuySmiley... yes! I love the look on Sal's face when he got the FULL glass of booze from Freddie.
NancyStowOH... awesome connection between Don and Freddie pissing themselves. Although, you might say that Dick lost his identity, too. It seems to me that he doesn't know who he is or what he wants.
How great was it that Jane bought the shirts for Don from Menkens?
Based on the clip they showed last week, I was certain that Peggy was mad at Pete for spilling the beans about their affair. I guess we'll just have to wait for that to happen.
I did not expect Roger to leave his wife for Jane! I believe that Don is genuinely disgusted by Roger's behavior and this will help to to figure out what is important and to do whatever he has to do to get back in Betty's good graces.
Another great episode. I don't know what I'm going to do at the end of the season. I'll be in serious withdrawal.
Why did Pete refer to Freddie as "those people." Is Freddie from a different class? I can't stand Pete. Freddie's too lovely to be working in that cutthroat environment.
I agree with the commentary on Don's character. He's got certain values I love and then I'm disgusted with his player ways...hard to judge him though. He's human. He comes off as a hard ass but he's good at heart, whereas Peggy comes off as the girl-next-door sweetheart but has a cold, almost diabolical heart. I kind of wish Don divorced her and followed his heart. He seems a free spirit who is trapped in a life he created and now despises.
Wonder if Duck ever wet himself before a client presentation during his days of drinking? I'm sure he had his share of blackouts. Not an ounce of compassion for Freddy (though I realize they have never been the best of friends). My bet is that he was so disgusted by his own past behavior that he's unleashing it all on Freddy.
Nice touch with Roger discussing Freddy's issues with drinking while pouring drinks....
mhcgrl - I, too, thought from the clip that Peggy was screaming at Pete because he blabbed about the baby. BUT... I have learned that the clips are never that obvious. Peggy will never confront Pete about the baby because she's in denial about it. Remember what Don said to her in the looney bin - "This never happened." (The Dick Whitman/Don Draper mantra - repeat after me - ohhhmmm)
From the very first episode last year Mad Men had been my favorite show. But I find one thing about it to be really annoying. Now is it just me, or is about 30 percent of what the characters say totally undecipherable? For a show with so many great production values the sound kinda sucks! (And what's with those dark offices in broad daylight?) It just always seems to be really difficult to understand what people are saying. So much so that this season I've taken to watching the encore with the closed captioning on just so I can find out what the hell was said. Anyone agree with me?
Oh yes, someone commented about Janes dress with the huge color blocks. Love it!
But I really love Peggy's dress for next week's episode. I saw it on the Mad Men Photo Shoot Photos on the AMC website. Black and White and looks great on Peggy! Love it!
Did someone mention Hazelton in this episode? I didn't know it was around that long.
This reminds me exactly of my in-laws. Dad in sales with a national aviation company right after WWII. Three martini lunches with clients, all white males, wives didn't work. Mom home with a houseful of kids and eventually turned to booze to deal with the emptiness of her life. He died at 62, she is still a drunk at 83. They were the perfect Don and Betty in their youth.
A lot of men, post WWII, judged other men by what they did in the war. Roger notes that at first he thought Freddie was in the Signal Corps, meaning not in combat. Then he learned that was only in the last six months of his service and before that he had performed some heroics in combat. 1945, to these guys, is 17 years ago. Like 1991 is to us. Doesn't seem very long ago to me.
Peggy comes off as the girl-next-door sweetheart but has a cold, almost diabolical heart.
Are you kidding? Peggy hasn't got a cold heart at all!
Pete is from the "upper crust". Although he sleeps around on his wife, alcoholics were considered "less manly" because they couldn't control themselves.
And yes, Marilyn's death was horrible to many people.
wow i cant believe the accuracy of the props! Betts had little "Salamander" stirring cookie dough in the exact same bowl as my mother used in the early sixties!!
NancyStowOH - I should know better by now that Mad Men is NEVER obvious! That's what makes it so great.
I was just thinking about what Roger said to Don. Something like, "Your loyalty is becoming a liability." As people have noted before... he's another example of Don's loyalty in all things business but lack of loyalty in his personal life.
As for the "dark lighting and indecipherable language" - the show is filmed that way on purpose. And the sound is very low. I have to crank it up during the episodes and turn it down during the commercials.
Now later into the episode, guess Freddie hadn't given blood . Can't figure this one out. Surprised that Betty was able to get out of bed and go to the stable. Guy Smiley, haven't gotten there yet but is it possible Betty was too depressed? I am discovering it is not good to try to guess what's coming up. I've been wrong on most. Obviously Freddy wet because he drank too much. So much for my R.N. expertise.They are firing Freddy because he drinks too much and they take him to a bar and get him drunk.Good friends
By the way, you gotta love the little details on this show. I loved how the girls in the office could hear the urine squishing around in his shoe when Freddy walked out of the office. (THAT I could actually hear.)
I found it odd when Roger said, "Need to call the Misses?" Since when did he care? NEVER. Obviously (I realize now) he already knew because of some pillow talk with skanky Jane on Jane St.
Mona told Don to talk to Margaret because Roger was able to explain himself more fully to his daughter than his wife. Roger told Margaret he decided to leave Mona because of his conversation with Don the night before. Margaret told Mona. That's how Mona found out about the conversation between Roger and Don. Mona wrongfully assumed Don talked Roger into leaving. She has no idea about Don and Betty.
Jane bought the shirts for Roger because she told Roger about Don's marital problems. Roger clued Jane in on Don's need for more shirts. Jane realized she received a secondary gain from buying shirts for Don. She ingratiated herself to him, it was a little flirty and she could give Roger a little thrill out of it, too.
Jimmy hitting the floor was so satisfying. What a jerk. The Freddy situation was so sad, though. Remember when he played Mozart on his zipper? That was so inappropriate that you had wonder how much longer he would be there.
I had a couple of thoughts about tonight's episode.
Marilyn Monroe was supposed to have committed suicide.
I think Freddy is heading that way. He kept saying to Don "What am I going to do?" Work has been his life...
Don said goodnight and Freddy said goodbye.
Maybe the common thread in episode 9 is either going forward, or, ending it all.
Ahh the blood drive is to save lives and the guys are joking about Freddie's accident and he is losing his working life.
Sal wouldn't be able to give blood now days if he indeed has engaged in homosexual activity. Nor Don most likely if they answer the pre-screening questionaire truthfully.
Mcmere - yes, he did say she was profoundly sad. And now, when she truly is profoundly sad, he doesn't notice it a bit. That's what I meant about it being ironic. :-)
GuySmiley - I think Betty skipped out on the lunch date because she wants her friend to be happy and have a little fun. Betty is clearly not interested in having an affair with the young man. She likes the attention though. Remember when they met at the club and he said that he would leave her alone and he was sorry of pursuing her? She quickly said, "Wait... let's be friends." I think if it were the right guy... someone she was really passionate about, she would totally have an affair.
I just realized that when Mona walked into Don's office, her dress looked black...like she was in mourning. It wasn't until she walked back out under the fluorescent lights that you see it's a deep navy. Nice one, costume department!
Don is such a perfect performance of a person incapable of feeling. He can't feel love, hate, anything. He is loyal but that is something he has witnessed and knows that society views as admirable. He tries to feel. He just can't. He wasn't born with it and it wasn't nurtured in him. He found a woman just like him. Hard to believe she knows so little about him, but she doesn't want to reveal too much either, so they are a perfect fit. Problem is, humans are made to connect, and without connections they eventually die. They die little by little, from the inside out. It isn't obvious at first and then as the years go by, it is impossible to dismiss or hide.
That's when the lid pops off, reality spills out everywhere and on everyone, affecting all those they are suppose to love and those that have loved them, leaving everyone wondering, "what the hell is happening?".
I'm hoping Pete gets his *ss kicked by Don. Don's very shrewd. I thought his conversation with Peggy where he tells her she'll be copywriting was a good demonstration of this. He questioned her in a way that helped him understand her character better. While he didn't show it, he would appreciate her loyalty to Freddie and the way she would have handled the situation which would have been to say nothing at all. It's good.
I liked it better when Roger was funny. He's going to have another coronary with Jane the gold digger.
Don actually looked and acted like a gentleman tonight. I loved it when he punched Jimmy, but I loved it more when he stood up for Freddie.
Someone posted that Margaret, Roger's daughter, was seeing a psychiatrist - she saw one when she was a teenager for awhile. With Roger for a father, why wouldn't she?
I loved, loved, loved, the scene with Betty in the kitchen defrosting the fridge and cutting the contact paper. Also, Sally stirring the cake mix - did that as a kid myself, along with mashing potatoes by hand.
Anyone have ideas on why Betty set up Arthur and Sarah Beth? I'm not sure if was being a friend to Sarah Beth or something else.
I predict Don will be back in the house next episode.
Pete's blue pajamas--I was young at the time of MM's death, but I don't remember anyone crying about it. People were shocked, but I didn't see anyone as emotional as it was portrayed. Is it just me, or was Don D particularly touching and vunerable in tonight's episode? I love him....
I think Betty was setting up her "friend" to get back at her for her comments about perfect Don.
There was something devious about the lunch date, did you notice that Betts took the phone off the hook so that Sara could not call to see where she was?
Freddie definitely has a medical condition - I would a seizure disorder because he seemed to be out of it when he was urinating his trousers and had a momentary lapse of memory just before he fell asleep.
I'll miss Freddie. It will be interesting to see how the staff turn on Pete now that they know he told on Freddie.
They all seem like alcoholics-some just seem to control it better than others. Each office has it's own bar and they have a closet full of the stuff. Anytime anyone goes to someone else's office, they are offered a drink. My parents had cocktails every day when my dad came home and now I wonder if he drank at work, too? Maybe the show is exaggerating it a bit because of the Mad Ave. theme-I hope so. Otherwise, seems like a whole generation of men would be plagued with cirrhosis of the liver!
NancyStowOH - Yes! Let's all say "Milwaukee" as our password to get into the convention! LOL.
And yes, someone mentioned Don was actually a gentleman in tonight's episode. I agree - with the whole sticking up for Freddie thing. Very much a man of loyalty.
I don't know if Freddie is going to kill himself but someone important to Roger is going to die. Joan's comment, something like "Someday you'll lose someone you really care about. Then you'll know." is a pretty good indication.
People in the 1960s did not routinely share their feelings. Don and Betty's marriage is very indicative of a lot of marriages at that time. Don, handsome and seemingly successful, Betty, groomed for "happily ever after". A lot of wheels came off marriages when the 1970s rolled around. That's also why Betty Friedans book was like a bomb back then to women.
Watch the preview for next week. Don berates Pete for not bothering to read Peggy's notes for the next meeting. Don hates Pete, and is looking for a way to get back at him.
Alcoholism was very big in the 1950s and 60s too - because no one talked about their feelings. So if Freddie had PSTS, he would have drank, not talked. But I doubt he'll commit suicide.
OMG - Don is actually JEALOUS of Freddy - he told Freddy it's a "fresh start." He told Freddy there were a lot of towns he could go to. I think if Don got a 6 month leave of absence he'd be long gone.
I don't think Betty was being under-handed by setting up Arthur to be at the lunch date. I think she was just helping her friend out. Hoping that at least her friend could have some enjoyment out of life - whereas Betty isn't enjoying life at the present time.
I think Duck's had a petit mal seizure. See how unresponsive he was and how he became incontinent? To my knowledge, that's what happens during a petit mal seizure.
Whoops...I meant Freddie.
.......Hi Clayton, excuse me for asking, but is 10:55 pm EST the correct time for your Open Thread?
It's 7:23 pm PST here...so shouldn't your Open Thread say 10:23 pm EST?
Thanks (sorry! carry on!).
.....and shouldn't my last entry say 10:27 pm EST? now it's an hour off......
I dunno Suze Freddie had been drinking
My time stamps look ok
And why is October 5, 2008 under the OP's name?
I'm glad to see Betty goin' after the drawer like it's an old squeaky chair!
.....MadMenSuze.....that's the expiration date of the thread. The thread will stay on top of all other threads until that date and time...
Okay, I see why he might have put that time on there....
However, the time label on my post is still wrong.
Who is the boxer? Floyd? (I don't follow the sport...). Why was Jimmy there? Just poetic license? I love hearing Freddy's history from WWII. Makes me appreciate him a lot more.
I like the parallel - Dick pissed his pants and got a new identity. Freddy did the same and lost his.
I am an R.N. that worked on the Red Cross Blood Mobile for many years. Don is right, many people [not just women] faint.Sometimes they go out completly and do become incontinent.That happens while they are giving blood not later so not sure what the whole thing with Freddie was about but I assume he gave blood.
Ah, there's the Pete I've always hated.
must correct above comment, a person can still pass out later and become incontinent, but not in the situation Freddy was in. I watch this during central time and didn't get started till late so I have some catching up to do. I apologize if everything I just said makes no scenes later. Boy is Betty ever depressed. Classic.
Cookie dough is my FAVORITE food! Betty is bringing those kids up right!
Does anyone else think that Pete looks like Pee Wee Herman? It just hit me with his last scene...
OMG! Roger! Jane! Jane! Roger! Schmuck - Slut - Slut - Schmuck.
Pee Wee - LOL! You're right!
The Floyd reference could be Floyd Patterson
Floyd is Floyd Patterson, heavyweight champion of the world at that time. After Jimmy gets up, he asks the champ how he did.
Whoa! I was dumbfounded and completely entranced by this week's episode.
I loved the look on Don's face when he got the shopping bag of shirts from Menkin's.
One question: When Mona shouted, "you can talk to Margaret!" Whom did she mean? I had the idea that Jane moved her way up horizontally to Roger's heart...
I guess now we know why Jane was dressed so conservatively...Now that she hooked into Roger, she only shows skin for him. Speak about 'hide in plain sight'.
Yeah--I was confused about the Margaret comment too.
Yes Floyd Patterson lost the title to Sony Liston the following month September 1962.
Margaret is Roger's daughter.
I thought it was interesting that the African-American elevator worker - the guy they usually say one word to then ignore and never treat as a peer - was the one to say "some people hide in plain sight."
I love how the actress who plays Carla portrays her conflict of having to be a doting housewife, all the while silently acknowledging that there is chaos in the Draper household. I remember a few episodes back when Don offers her a ride home, she wants no part of the Draper's drama to come to her private life. I totally understand that one, sister!
Meanwhile, I don't really get why Bets would skip out on the lunch date. Had she wanted to give her friend the pleasure of seeking excitement through an affair? Why is she staying at home then?
Love Joan and Sterling talking about Marilyn, and their comparisons. Obviously they have set her up as a Marilyn archetype.
Who is Margaret? I thought that was Roger's daughter's name. What did Mona mean by that. Roger in love with his secretary, Jane? I thought that was Don's secretary.
Martini Up: you are so right. pete does look like pee wee herman. i have thought all this time he looked like someone but couldnt put my finger on it. so, did don fire jane because roger seemed to get friendly with her after mona left by putting his hand on her shoulder or because she didnt stop mona from barging in his office? do you think that the news about marilyn monroe's suicide is leading into freddy committing suicide? he did say if he doesnt go to work on monday, what am i? just a thought.
Typo. In my last comment, housewife=housekeeper.
Did anyone love the expression that Sal is giving when he sizes up the overfull glass that Freddy hands him?
I love love love watching Betty defrost the fridge using a bowl of hot water, and then cutting drawer liner papers--- reminds me of my childhood, watching my mother do her kitchen upkeep.
I imagine Margaret will be Mona's lawyer. As to Jane...I mentioned in a previous post about Joan and Jane that being the boss's girlfriend is a powerful position in an office, as least in the offices I have worked in. I can't imagine however that the current story arc that has Joan on her way out won't turn somehow. She is too important a character in my view. I love the professional bond between Don and Peggy.
Lots of lounging on couches going on with this episode: Joan on Roger's couch, Betty on her couch when the doorbell rang, Pete on his couch, and even ol' Don on his. Gotta get a couch for my office....
Clearly, Don did not want to sully his hands with a homewrecker like Jane. Remember that he's trying to act like he didn't have an affair, even when confronted about it playfully by both Roger (this ep.) and also Bobbie (two eps. back).
Betty is living vicariously through Sara Beth. She's not ready to have an affair just yet, but she's taking baby steps by setting her friend up for one.
I liked how she took the phone off the hook while they prepared their cookie dough lunch. Nice touch.
Isn't Margaret Roger's daughter? And those shirts from Menkins...Do you think Rachel helped picked them out knowing they were for Don? Or did she just give a store discount for old times? LOL
I think Mona just meant to say to Roger that he can tell their daughter, Margaret, that he is leaving Mona after 25 years of marriage for a girl about Margaret's own age. (Sorry if the grammar was off there.)
Roger is schtupping Jane. Don wants her off the desk because he doesn't want to be part of it. Jane got emotional because it all came out right in front of everyone.
Remember, Joan told her she knew exactly what was going on after Jane went to Roger and kept her job.
Did they offer a 6mth pd leave to Freddie or did they fire him? If the latter, I don't get why the posture.
Freddie is moving into an advanced stage of alcoholism.
Like they say, "Denial is a river in Egypt."
And it looks like Betty is hitting the wine bottle a bit more, now, as well.
Booze, the great escape. Until it bites you in the butt.
Why did Jane buy Don some shirts? At first I thought she might be flirting with him. But now, after learning she is having an affair with Sterling, I don't think that.
So why?
WELL....
The episode is soooo good; January Jones is a fantastic actress because she has allowed me to totally despise the character of Bette as a mother, wonder about her as a woman, and feel a bit sorry for her a wife.
Re: her inability to nurture her children...every time i see bette interact with her children i think about the lyric in the Janis Ian song of the late 60s.."I leaving home after living alone for so many years"...she is the typical privileged suburban housewife who can afford to indulge her psychic pain by sleeping late and ignoring/berating her children. I can just see Sally and Bobbie being disaffected teens who choose to run to Haight-Asbury and tune in, turn on and drop out with lots of drugs and sex cause mom didn't have the time to put the world in perspective for them when they were much younger and made them pay for the indiscretions of their dad....
.... Oh Freddie Rumson....that scene in his office was a classic...he has been messing up for quite a while and this is the straw yada yada yada...I am sure that he was the best years ago but he has allowed alochol to ruin all his best instincts and talents...great that Don was so loyal..which brings me to another point. While we all know that Don is a big 'ho" I also know that Don an amazing set of principals that don't ever seem to be reflected in the general population of S/C...he is extremely supportive of his creative team and especially Peggy (support he gave her when she was in the hospital and the opportuity he created for her when he and Rumson noticed her talent as a copy writer and even slapping Roger when he as incanting another woman's name after his heart attack...his attempts to connect solidly with his children and even his support of Bette when she was quite less than a helpmate last season...I also remember a small scene in the elevator when he made those young men change their tone and conversation and take off their hats....
.....it also looks as if Pete is getting on Peggy's last nerve with his selfish egotism and that finally, we will get to see Carla and the elevator operator as people rather than props in another world...
...all i have to say for now
the diva
I take it back. I think, as Peachy and Pete's Pajamas said, Margaret is Roger's daughter, the one who is seeing a shrink.
I LOVE Jane's dress with the colored squares in comparison to Betty's dress with the colored polka-dots. Jane's affair with the boss is bold, point-blank, cut and dried and ends up out in the open. Don's affairs are mixed up, a myriad of women and meeting places and are well hidden from his child-like wife. These visual expressions couldn't be any better.
They fired Freddie. They just gave him a way out. That's how business was handled in the 60s.
Betty is setting up her friend so she won't feel bad when the news that she and Don separated - and she won't be singled out at the country club.
Okay - let me try to explain this:
Roger is having an affair - and thinks he's in love - with Jane. Mona's comment about Margaret meant that Roger will have to tell their daughter what is going on - she (Mona) is not going to be the dutiful enabler anymore - that Roger is going to have to be a grown up and and take responsibility for this one with his little girl (now 18?) who thinks he's perfect.
Don is firing Jane because OBVIOUSLY Jane and Roger were talking about him.
I like how Joan says she is just another frivolous secretary to Roger
I agree with Born in 1960 - Yes, Betty is living through her friend (by setting her up to have an affair) because she isn't ready to have one herself, yet.
And how about when Don said "Good Night" to Freddie. And Freddie answered, "Good Bye". I think that says a lot. Freddie knows he won't be coming back.
Well, I am new to the whole Mad Men craze, and I have to say that I am officially in love with this show now. I tried to catch up with the marathon that they showed last week. So, I will be watching it from now on. And I liked this week's episode, especially when Don punched that Barrett guy in the face at the underground casino.
Pete is an ass, and he'll get his comeuppance from Peggy soon enough. Don's already threatening him.
Betty is a socialite mother. She doesn't really like the kids, they are just part of the "perfect" package.
Jane brought the shirts because Roger told her behind the scenes of Don's "coming in too early" - how else would she know?
GuySmiley... yes! I love the look on Sal's face when he got the FULL glass of booze from Freddie.
NancyStowOH... awesome connection between Don and Freddie pissing themselves. Although, you might say that Dick lost his identity, too. It seems to me that he doesn't know who he is or what he wants.
How great was it that Jane bought the shirts for Don from Menkens?
Based on the clip they showed last week, I was certain that Peggy was mad at Pete for spilling the beans about their affair. I guess we'll just have to wait for that to happen.
I did not expect Roger to leave his wife for Jane! I believe that Don is genuinely disgusted by Roger's behavior and this will help to to figure out what is important and to do whatever he has to do to get back in Betty's good graces.
Another great episode. I don't know what I'm going to do at the end of the season. I'll be in serious withdrawal.
Freddy killed how many Germans? And he's supposed to feel like a hero because of it? No wonder he's an alcoholic.
I don't think Jane is getting fired. Don just says he "wants her off his desk." She'll be transferred to someone else.
Don punching Jimmy Barrett may have consequences later. That will be interesting to see.
Looks like, from the previews, that maybe Don and Betty start the road back to their marriage?? Especially after Roger tossed it all away.
I can't wait for Joan's take on the whole Roger/Jane affair now that it's out in the open.
Did women really cry that much when hearing about Marilyn Monroe's death? Just curious.
Why did Pete refer to Freddie as "those people." Is Freddie from a different class? I can't stand Pete. Freddie's too lovely to be working in that cutthroat environment.
I agree with the commentary on Don's character. He's got certain values I love and then I'm disgusted with his player ways...hard to judge him though. He's human. He comes off as a hard ass but he's good at heart, whereas Peggy comes off as the girl-next-door sweetheart but has a cold, almost diabolical heart. I kind of wish Don divorced her and followed his heart. He seems a free spirit who is trapped in a life he created and now despises.
Wonder if Duck ever wet himself before a client presentation during his days of drinking? I'm sure he had his share of blackouts. Not an ounce of compassion for Freddy (though I realize they have never been the best of friends). My bet is that he was so disgusted by his own past behavior that he's unleashing it all on Freddy.
Nice touch with Roger discussing Freddy's issues with drinking while pouring drinks....
Yes, he's a hero for killing Germans. Men were routinely congratulated on their kills in the war.
mhcgrl - I, too, thought from the clip that Peggy was screaming at Pete because he blabbed about the baby. BUT... I have learned that the clips are never that obvious. Peggy will never confront Pete about the baby because she's in denial about it. Remember what Don said to her in the looney bin - "This never happened." (The Dick Whitman/Don Draper mantra - repeat after me - ohhhmmm)
From the very first episode last year Mad Men had been my favorite show. But I find one thing about it to be really annoying. Now is it just me, or is about 30 percent of what the characters say totally undecipherable? For a show with so many great production values the sound kinda sucks! (And what's with those dark offices in broad daylight?) It just always seems to be really difficult to understand what people are saying. So much so that this season I've taken to watching the encore with the closed captioning on just so I can find out what the hell was said. Anyone agree with me?
Oh yes, someone commented about Janes dress with the huge color blocks. Love it!
But I really love Peggy's dress for next week's episode. I saw it on the Mad Men Photo Shoot Photos on the AMC website. Black and White and looks great on Peggy! Love it!
Did someone mention Hazelton in this episode? I didn't know it was around that long.
This reminds me exactly of my in-laws. Dad in sales with a national aviation company right after WWII. Three martini lunches with clients, all white males, wives didn't work. Mom home with a houseful of kids and eventually turned to booze to deal with the emptiness of her life. He died at 62, she is still a drunk at 83. They were the perfect Don and Betty in their youth.
Pete's "those people" meant alcoholics.
A lot of men, post WWII, judged other men by what they did in the war. Roger notes that at first he thought Freddie was in the Signal Corps, meaning not in combat. Then he learned that was only in the last six months of his service and before that he had performed some heroics in combat. 1945, to these guys, is 17 years ago. Like 1991 is to us. Doesn't seem very long ago to me.
Oh! And this is wild! The other day I drank a Heneiken - all because of this show!
And, I bought Utz potato chips - again, because of Mad Men!
How cool is that?! A show about advertising and it worked on me!
Peggy comes off as the girl-next-door sweetheart but has a cold, almost diabolical heart.
Are you kidding? Peggy hasn't got a cold heart at all!
Pete is from the "upper crust". Although he sleeps around on his wife, alcoholics were considered "less manly" because they couldn't control themselves.
And yes, Marilyn's death was horrible to many people.
Wonder if I'll start smoking Lucky Strikes next? (Do they even still make Lucky Strikes?)
Pete is a piranha that will stab anybody in the back to climb the ladder at SC.
wow i cant believe the accuracy of the props! Betts had little "Salamander" stirring cookie dough in the exact same bowl as my mother used in the early sixties!!
NancyStowOH - I should know better by now that Mad Men is NEVER obvious! That's what makes it so great.
I was just thinking about what Roger said to Don. Something like, "Your loyalty is becoming a liability." As people have noted before... he's another example of Don's loyalty in all things business but lack of loyalty in his personal life.
Hazelten has been around almost 60 years.
As for the "dark lighting and indecipherable language" - the show is filmed that way on purpose. And the sound is very low. I have to crank it up during the episodes and turn it down during the commercials.
Now later into the episode, guess Freddie hadn't given blood . Can't figure this one out. Surprised that Betty was able to get out of bed and go to the stable. Guy Smiley, haven't gotten there yet but is it possible Betty was too depressed? I am discovering it is not good to try to guess what's coming up. I've been wrong on most. Obviously Freddy wet because he drank too much. So much for my R.N. expertise.They are firing Freddy because he drinks too much and they take him to a bar and get him drunk.Good friends
By the way, you gotta love the little details on this show. I loved how the girls in the office could hear the urine squishing around in his shoe when Freddy walked out of the office. (THAT I could actually hear.)
I looked it up, and Hazeldon has been in existence since 1949, according to their website.
I found it odd when Roger said, "Need to call the Misses?" Since when did he care? NEVER. Obviously (I realize now) he already knew because of some pillow talk with skanky Jane on Jane St.
Mona told Don to talk to Margaret because Roger was able to explain himself more fully to his daughter than his wife. Roger told Margaret he decided to leave Mona because of his conversation with Don the night before. Margaret told Mona. That's how Mona found out about the conversation between Roger and Don. Mona wrongfully assumed Don talked Roger into leaving. She has no idea about Don and Betty.
Jane bought the shirts for Roger because she told Roger about Don's marital problems. Roger clued Jane in on Don's need for more shirts. Jane realized she received a secondary gain from buying shirts for Don. She ingratiated herself to him, it was a little flirty and she could give Roger a little thrill out of it, too.
Jimmy hitting the floor was so satisfying. What a jerk. The Freddy situation was so sad, though. Remember when he played Mozart on his zipper? That was so inappropriate that you had wonder how much longer he would be there.
And, as others have stated, I am amazed at the accuracy (props) of the show.
"The clients -- they already think we're all like that," says Roger as he and Don toss back drinks. Ha!
Ironic, isn't it, that when Betty is truly in a state of deep clinical depression, Arthur finds her profoundly happy?
ldraper:
You can't compare today with the early 60s. People routinely drank, drank and drove, fired someone over drinks to ease the guilt.
Betty got her ass out of bed for two reasons: one, she was called out by Carla and two, to set up the horseman and her friend.
Sorry, Zabadu, I don't agree. Peggy's cold. She's cold to her kids. It seems she's setting up Sara Beth. She's unlikeable.
itsmylife:
That's Betty, not Peggy, and yes BETTY is horrible.
I had a couple of thoughts about tonight's episode.
Marilyn Monroe was supposed to have committed suicide.
I think Freddy is heading that way. He kept saying to Don "What am I going to do?" Work has been his life...
Don said goodnight and Freddy said goodbye.
Maybe the common thread in episode 9 is either going forward, or, ending it all.
To I REMEMBER - Thanks for your input on why you thought Jane bought the shirts. I was wondering about that.
Are we all feeding on the drama of other people's lives like teenage girls?
I think he said she was profoundly sad, didn't he?
I thought Arthur found Betty "so profoundly sad". She told him she wasn't sad, she was "grateful".
Ahh the blood drive is to save lives and the guys are joking about Freddie's accident and he is losing his working life.
Sal wouldn't be able to give blood now days if he indeed has engaged in homosexual activity. Nor Don most likely if they answer the pre-screening questionaire truthfully.
Mcmere - yes, he did say she was profoundly sad. And now, when she truly is profoundly sad, he doesn't notice it a bit. That's what I meant about it being ironic. :-)
Yes, I think Freddie is going to kill himself too. Like others have stated, I think that was the connection with Marilyn Monroe being in the episode.
They didn't have the pre-screening rules in the 1960s for giving blood.
GuySmiley - I think Betty skipped out on the lunch date because she wants her friend to be happy and have a little fun. Betty is clearly not interested in having an affair with the young man. She likes the attention though. Remember when they met at the club and he said that he would leave her alone and he was sorry of pursuing her? She quickly said, "Wait... let's be friends." I think if it were the right guy... someone she was really passionate about, she would totally have an affair.
I just realized that when Mona walked into Don's office, her dress looked black...like she was in mourning. It wasn't until she walked back out under the fluorescent lights that you see it's a deep navy. Nice one, costume department!
NancyStowOH - Yes, that is ironic - Now that Betty is truly sad, that he didn't even notice.
Don is such a perfect performance of a person incapable of feeling. He can't feel love, hate, anything. He is loyal but that is something he has witnessed and knows that society views as admirable. He tries to feel. He just can't. He wasn't born with it and it wasn't nurtured in him. He found a woman just like him. Hard to believe she knows so little about him, but she doesn't want to reveal too much either, so they are a perfect fit. Problem is, humans are made to connect, and without connections they eventually die. They die little by little, from the inside out. It isn't obvious at first and then as the years go by, it is impossible to dismiss or hide.
That's when the lid pops off, reality spills out everywhere and on everyone, affecting all those they are suppose to love and those that have loved them, leaving everyone wondering, "what the hell is happening?".
I love Roger saying that his alcoholic podiatrist came back a "new man" who "only" drinks beer now. LOL!
Does anyone think Freddie may have PTSD? Roger mentions that he killed Germans in WW2 -- perhaps the alcoholism is a symptom of residual trauma?
Oops, yup, meant Betty.
I'm hoping Pete gets his *ss kicked by Don. Don's very shrewd. I thought his conversation with Peggy where he tells her she'll be copywriting was a good demonstration of this. He questioned her in a way that helped him understand her character better. While he didn't show it, he would appreciate her loyalty to Freddie and the way she would have handled the situation which would have been to say nothing at all. It's good.
I liked it better when Roger was funny. He's going to have another coronary with Jane the gold digger.
Don actually looked and acted like a gentleman tonight. I loved it when he punched Jimmy, but I loved it more when he stood up for Freddie.
Someone posted that Margaret, Roger's daughter, was seeing a psychiatrist - she saw one when she was a teenager for awhile. With Roger for a father, why wouldn't she?
I loved, loved, loved, the scene with Betty in the kitchen defrosting the fridge and cutting the contact paper. Also, Sally stirring the cake mix - did that as a kid myself, along with mashing potatoes by hand.
Anyone have ideas on why Betty set up Arthur and Sarah Beth? I'm not sure if was being a friend to Sarah Beth or something else.
I predict Don will be back in the house next episode.
At our Maddict convention, we should all have to say "Milwaukee" to get in!
Pete's blue pajamas--I was young at the time of MM's death, but I don't remember anyone crying about it. People were shocked, but I didn't see anyone as emotional as it was portrayed. Is it just me, or was Don D particularly touching and vunerable in tonight's episode? I love him....
I can't wait until next week - to see Joan and if she says anything to Jane!
I think Betty was setting up her "friend" to get back at her for her comments about perfect Don.
There was something devious about the lunch date, did you notice that Betts took the phone off the hook so that Sara could not call to see where she was?
Forgot to put this in my post.
Freddie definitely has a medical condition - I would a seizure disorder because he seemed to be out of it when he was urinating his trousers and had a momentary lapse of memory just before he fell asleep.
I'll miss Freddie. It will be interesting to see how the staff turn on Pete now that they know he told on Freddie.
They all seem like alcoholics-some just seem to control it better than others. Each office has it's own bar and they have a closet full of the stuff. Anytime anyone goes to someone else's office, they are offered a drink. My parents had cocktails every day when my dad came home and now I wonder if he drank at work, too? Maybe the show is exaggerating it a bit because of the Mad Ave. theme-I hope so. Otherwise, seems like a whole generation of men would be plagued with cirrhosis of the liver!
NancyStowOH - Yes! Let's all say "Milwaukee" as our password to get into the convention! LOL.
And yes, someone mentioned Don was actually a gentleman in tonight's episode. I agree - with the whole sticking up for Freddie thing. Very much a man of loyalty.
I don't know if Freddie is going to kill himself but someone important to Roger is going to die. Joan's comment, something like "Someday you'll lose someone you really care about. Then you'll know." is a pretty good indication.
People in the 1960s did not routinely share their feelings. Don and Betty's marriage is very indicative of a lot of marriages at that time. Don, handsome and seemingly successful, Betty, groomed for "happily ever after". A lot of wheels came off marriages when the 1970s rolled around. That's also why Betty Friedans book was like a bomb back then to women.
Watch the preview for next week. Don berates Pete for not bothering to read Peggy's notes for the next meeting. Don hates Pete, and is looking for a way to get back at him.
Alcoholism was very big in the 1950s and 60s too - because no one talked about their feelings. So if Freddie had PSTS, he would have drank, not talked. But I doubt he'll commit suicide.
OMG - Don is actually JEALOUS of Freddy - he told Freddy it's a "fresh start." He told Freddy there were a lot of towns he could go to. I think if Don got a 6 month leave of absence he'd be long gone.
I don't think Betty was being under-handed by setting up Arthur to be at the lunch date. I think she was just helping her friend out. Hoping that at least her friend could have some enjoyment out of life - whereas Betty isn't enjoying life at the present time.
"Someday you'll lose someone you really care about. Then you'll know."
That was about his wife - Joan knew Roger was sleeping with Jane, remember?