Don and Pete are Pathetic!

Watching tonight's episode with Don and Pete was pathetic! Both men are totally beyond disgusting. The fat that they can unabashedly carry on affairs with women in a "wham, bam, thank you mam" sort of way and clean up and move on to the next woman like nothing ever happended is just beyond comprehension to me! Moreover, for Don to tie up a woman to a bedpost because she would not stop talking is about as freakish and disgusting as one can get! I think he wanted to practice some S&M
on her! SAD DISGUSTING FREAK!!!!

Peggy's pantyhose

While pantyhose were invented in 1959, they were not commonly available for retail purchase untile 1965. Since this episode presumably takes place in 1961, how could Peggy be wearing pantyhose?

Peggy, Don, and Herbal cigarettes

YAY for Peggy! I was hoping that she would show up at the club! Too bad she still seems to need Campbell's approvals of her behavior. And Campbell! He really is trying to take Don's job...as an unhappy, sex and control starved jerk. My, my,my. Now to Don: did he really think that with all the sex he has all around town that no one would talk? Why does it bother him? It seems the women are giving him great reviews. Is he afraid of other people finding out that he is really as deceitful of a man as his father? (I am referring to the flashback of Don as a child when the vagabond visited his home.) (And yes, I understand that I am writing as though these are real people rather than characters on a show :))

So, herbal cigarettes. I read on another post on here that the actors are smoking herbal cigarettes. But, those still must have some danger associated with them, right? I mean they smoke a lot! If herbal cigarettes are safe then why are they not available to the general public so that I can take up smoking again!

Episode 5 - Open Thread

Talk about Episode 5, "The New Girl".

mad men

you're really doing your part to destroy the American family with adultery lying stealing and cheating. Just because the public wants this you don't have the wallo in it's swil.

Hurrica,ne

To anyone in the Gulf area still reading this forum: please stay safe, my thoughts and prayers are with you. To any members of the MM forum with family and friends in the Gulf area, I wish the same.

Working Wives

I can't remember any of the executives having wives who work or have a career. But, I wasn't watching for it so might have missed hearing something. I hearing men...both blue collar and white collar, state that 'no wife of mine will work'. It was an ego thing, in many cases, as the husband feared the men at his work would think he couldn't afford to take care of is family. The executive wives probably belong to clubs, junior league, and volunteer, but do any of them get a paycheck?

Episode 6

Hi fellow Maddicts!! Tonight's episode is called "Maidenform". For my female Maddicts: Do we have to put on our bras for this episode. or take them off in protest? Any male Maddicts who need to put on your bros (with apologies to Jerry Seinfeld) get ready!
Does anyone know if Maidenform bras are still being made?

Episode 6 are you ready?

Its been a long week.Cant wait for tonite's episode.When is the marathon set to begin?

La Notte

Has anyone confirmed that La Notte is, finally, the Film Don watches at the matinee? La Notte was translated into French, La Nuit, but are we sure (even though he mentioned La Notte in Episode 5) that this is "the" film we've been dying to ascertain?

Music in Mad Men

Bach in Three Sundays, "Sukiyaki" in Flight 1 - sometimes the use of music and pop songs in MM is historically or culturally accurate...and sometimes not. Anyone here fondly remember Top 40 radio of the early 60s? Find some tuneful clips on my blog: http://cantara.vox.com/library/posts/tags/mad+men

Smoking Behaviors

Growing up in the 1950s and 60s, I remember several behaviors regarding smoking that are not depicted accurately. Here are a few observations:
1)Smoking around Children: This was usually considering bad form except for the most diehard smokers. This was partly because children were considered not to have the constitution of an adult and partly becasue it added to the cool of being an adult. This was one of the reasons why teens wanted to smoke so much.
2) Smoking While Eating: This was usually not done until after the meal was over even in public places.

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What Did Bobbi Mean?

In the scene between Bobbi and Peggy (the day she was wearing the pink shirtwaist), Bobbi began to question Peggy to gain an understanding of the connection between her and Don.

"He's a decent man, isn't he? You wouldn't think he would be."

"I never expect him to be any other way than what he is."

Why do you think Bobbi is surprised that Don is 'decent?' What did he do that surprised Bobbi into re-categorizing him? Did she suddenly realize the image is different than the man she met? Is she in love with him? (She did give him that schoolgirl line, "I didn't think you'd call.")

I wish there wouldn't be an "Open Thread" blog!

I've been gone all week working and now that I get back, there are 347 comments for me to catch up on in order to join in conversation. It's easier to have a topic and if like it join in and comment. It's also fun to see if your topic was chosen as one of the "most popular" or "recommended". Does anyone else feel this way?

Bobbi Barrett-Tragedy in the making or...?

Bobbi Barrett-Tragedy or...?

Seems to me the Bobbi character has finally begun to set in the show. I wondered for a while if she might end up a sort of plot device to allow Don to be "caught" by Betty. That still may be the result, we'll see, but the character seems to be growing as Mad Men characters do and nearing a crossroads-She's falling in love with Don. I really think her defensive wariness with Peggy was a clear indication she has developed a real attachment, even if she maintains the air of this being a fun fling with a gorgeous hunk. For Don, I think he is living out the "cheap affair" Rachel accused him of wanting with her and that could lead to tragedy. For all her pose and poise, Bobbi is in crisis. She was probably already feeling trapped by advancing age when her younger dancer self latched on to Jimmy Barrett and she's getting no younger (though we may get a surprise from Jimmy when things blow up). We saw her harping continuously on Peggy's youth and Peggy sized up the woman's desperation immediately, "I'm not your competition". She has no security except as Jimmy's manager and if she lost that she's likely just a bit too ahead of her time to be able to find a similar position. To have Don reject or dismiss her could be the final straw. And for Don, she is really quite the perfect woman for Betty to learn about...Probably exactly the sort of woman Betty imagines he is taken up with. For him to be caught in or somehow confess to an affair with Bobbi would probably be the least dangerous exposure in his philandering career. Betty would be angry but pleased to find her competition so slight...Stern but forgiving. Just the temptations of Manhattan high life and a trashy seducteress...

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Emmy Nominations -- Season 1

I am waiting the arrival of my copy of the DVD and will soon be able to take a leisurely look at the first season. I already know how I react to the series/stories/characters, so I took time to see look at what Emmy singled out for recognition. Remember, these nominations are for work done in Season 1....
Let's see....

The series was recognized with nominations for:

Outstanding Main Title Design
Outstanding Drama-Series
Outstanding Casting
Outstanding Cinematography

The four episodes separated from Season 1 for recognition are:

"Smoke Gets in Your Eyes"
Outstanding Writing-Drama Series
Art Direction-Single Camera Series
Outstanding Costumes-Series
Outstanding Directing

"Shoot"
Outstanding Hairstyling-Single Camera Series

"The Hobo Code"
Outstanding Makeup (Non-Prosthetic)-Single Camera Series

"The Wheel"
Outstanding Writing-Drama Series

Jon Hamm was nominated for Best Actor-Drama; John Slattery was nominated as Best Supporting Actor-Drama; and Robert Morse was nominated for Outstanding Guest Actor -Drama Series.

None of our ladies were nominated in any category. Was this an oversight? Will the ladies' performances in Season 2 change that statistic? Which of you favorites in Season 1 were overlooked? Next year, what will the list look like? Do you think the total Mad Men nominations will be even higher next year?

Attractive Joan Expanding A Bit Too Much

I always like Joan and thought her very attractive. She at least LOOKS like a woman, and not some stick thin figure with no hips or bust. However, wasn't she a C cup last season and now she must be a Double D. If her dresses get any tighter there is going to be a wardrobe malfunction! Again, she is the most attractive of the lot. Betty is too ice princess cool; Rachel Menken needed an eyebrow waxing; Bobbie is trashy looking; and Peggy (again, don't want to offend Peggy fans, but that woman is just not attractive to me. She has no figure, her clothes are dull and drab, and that ponytail makes her look very unsophisticated, as though she should be running across a college campus, NOT working in a NYC ad agency; Don's new secretary is the only one who could give Joan a run for her money in the looks department. Joan was a knock out last season and still is, but if her hips and derriere - and her bustline - gets any bigger, she is going to be mistaken for the office Xerox Machine!

Off Topic- How can I get a cool picture with my post?

I see these cute photos and images some of you have with your posts- how did you do that?

What did Peggy need to do to leave the hospital?

Don asks Peggy if she knows what "they" (the doctors) at the hospital want, and she says no, she doesn't. Don tells her that she does, and then says to give it to them, so she can get out of there and move on. What does she need to do?

Current social conventions that will die?

One of MM's best features is how it cariactures social conventions that were unconsciously acceptable in the 60's but are viewed as unacceptable now. We, of course, suffer from the same unconscious acceptance of practices that will be rejected in the future. Anyone dare to imagine that we know what 2040 will look like and predict current conventions that we now accept but society will have discarded by then?

Brian Krause (aka Leo in Charmed)

I'm a Brian Krause fan.....it is my understanding that Brian Krause will be guest starring in an upcoming episode of MAD MEN....someone please confirm this for me!!!!!

The Peggy/Don Secret Connection

I haven't seen this discussed before but it's been touched on in other threads this episode.

Remember the first episode when Peggy comes in and gives Don papers and touches his hand? WHY would she do that? Had she had an encounter with him and he got her a job there or something?

Please send your thoughts...

It's Turning into a Soap Opera

I really enjoyed the story lines last season dealing with the advertising business in the sixties. The strategies and corporate interactions were fascinating. However, this season is one big soap opera. "Will Betts sleep with the stable boy? Why can't Don get it up? Why can't the Campbells have children. The office manager get's engaged and Sterling laments. Peggy's sister confesses to the priest in an attempt to undermine Peggy." OMG, put this show on at 1PM with All My Children. I hope the producers turn this around or Mad Men will be an "also ran" at the Golden Globes.

Don's cash

What is up with Don not having much cash in his wallet? I only notice that because it came up more than once in the last episode. His life is becoming almost schizophrenic as he balances the various compartments, but I wonder if he has another secret we don't know about, and it is taking his cash on hand. For all we know about his past, he might have fathered a child, and is supporting it. How much spending cash would a man of his career and time have carried?

Twitter

Was anyone here using the Twitter feeds before AMC had them shut down?

Second Season - A Disappointment

I like this show. I like it a lot, but Season 2 is a disappointment. Where this show has really shone is when the characters and the era they inhabit come together to tell us about what we were and by comparison illuminate what we've become. I am thinking of Don's introduction of "LSMFT" for the Lucky Strike campaign and the whole aura of cigarette smoking at that time, the shock over rumors of marital infedelity in the Draper's neighborhood, Betty's struggles to maintain sanity in a society that offers her few options, Sal's sad determination to remain safe in the closet, and Don Draper's masterful paean to the family at the Kodak Carousel presentation followed by his return to an empty house on the night before Thanksgiving. Those episodes were powerful.

Thus far, Season 2 has not offered anything comparable. Where are the early 1960s? Other than horseback riding references to Jackie Kennedy, the fact that one of the copywriters has an African-American girlfriend, and the number of scenes with TVs in them has increased, it is little changed from Season 1. Episode 5 ends in the middle of 1962. I am old enough to remember the summer of '62 when tensions between the US and the USSR were ratcheting up dramatically in preparation for the showdown in October. They were scary times compared to the sleepy '50s, but you would not know it from recent episodes of "Mad Men". These characters are still living in the year 1960, the dull part of it at that.

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At the police station and at Peggy

Don is told the fine is $150 yet tells him he'll call for a taxi and have an employee bring out the $500. Then the cop says sarcastically, "or maybe your wife has a friend". Also Don hears the heels clicking and seems almost surprised to see it's Peggy. What's up with Peggy's white gloves so late at night too, were gloves worn all the time like that?

Accidental or Intentional

At first, it seemed Don controlled his life, his decisions. Now, I'm not so sure that he ever did, and maybe most of his life has been accidental. What is Don's current state - intentional or just waiting for something accidental to propel things along?

the real don draper

what was the family of don draper told when he didn't return from korea?

Did you see the TV go out of tune?

Did anyone else notice the attention to detail-when Peggy walked past her TV (about 29-31 minutes in) it went out of tune? Great job by the set designers, directors!

Rachel and Don

Don likes women. He has the blonde Madonna-type Betty at home. She has her place in his heart, and on his arm in public.

He had Midge, who must have seemed as opposite to Betty's dependency as could be. A beautiful free spirit who offered fun but also could talk.

He and Bobbi remind me of old friends who share similar backgrounds, he sees her as a party girl who it is easy to forget with.

Then there is Rachel. She might be the one who the adult Don would have chosen as his bride had he not already have encumbered himself with the perfect blonde housewife. It is what he gets for trying to create a picture perfect life instead of waiting for it to happen in its own good time.

So, Don likes a variety of types of women. If he were married to Rachel, would he be faithful to her?

why do you think Don went looking for Peggy?

Peggy was missing for months and Don was eventually told she had TB but he kept looking until he found her in a mental ward. Why did he do this?? he said he doesn't even look at a secretary until she been there a month and he fired Peggy's first replacement without blinking. Not to mention, he seems to perpetually ignore Joan.

so why hunt down Peggy? usually not showing up for work is grounds to be fired. was he just being nosey? caring? [for once]

Why didn't my entry show up

I submitted a video for the contest, it said that it was successfully submitted, but my video never showed up. Can anyone help

New Talk Forum Functionality

Hi - We noticed a number comments regarding the way the Talk forum works, and we've made some quick improvements to respond to the feedback. Our goal, per your feedback, was to make it easier for you to engage in one large discussion (rather than be segmented into many sub-conversations), as well as to easily find specific Talk topics posted by individual users. Here are the three things we've done. 1.) We've introduced a weekly "open thread" that is featured at the top of the Talk forum, where you can meet up with fellow fans and engage in wide-ranging talk about each week's episode. 2.) We've created a page that lists, minus clutter, every Talk topic. The link to this new page is at the top of the Talk page under the heading "View List of All Talk Topics." 3.) We've also created a link to a page listing all the episode open threads, under the heading "Open Threads for Each Episode." This link is also at the top of the Talk page.

These are just some improvements that we were able to roll out quickly, our goal being to address your feedback immediately. We'll also take a deeper look at the design and functionality of Talk forum for more long-term improvements. Let us know any additional feedback you may have. Thanks.

Pete, Trudy and WASP Marriages

Is Pete and Trudy's marriage supposed to be a representative example of a typical WASP marriage in 1960s America?

They both seem very repressed. He seems at the very least to be apathetic towards her if not downright loath her. She, on the other hand, seems to take and accept his "abuse". Any thoughts?

Is the New Girl Jewish?

Jane Siegel...is she just a flash in the pan, or do we think this might open up a storyline about Jews in the ad biz or anti-semitism?

Read the Official Plot Summaries

Another viewer has pointed out that in the plot summaries it says that in the Three Sundays episode that as Peggy is leaving she sees three children in a room, including a blonde, blue eyed child who is with his cousins. Why are the writers pointing out the cousins plus details of the child's appearance? We all know about genetics but neither Pete nor Peggy have blonde hair and I'm not sure if either has blue eyes.
Also we were tricked about the Ossining location of Don & Betty's house. Isn't there a University in Stoney Brook? Did one of the writers go to school there or something?

Joan's DYNAMITE figure !!!

Joan's figure, is the figure that I remember women having as a child. The only thing missing is I can't smell her Worth, or Channel. I love her character because she can play with the BIG BOYS, and remain ultra feminine. In those days to be feminine was an art form, and this actress has it down pat. Bravo

The Women Behind the Mad Men

EPISODE 5 WAS ALL ABOUT THE WOMEN BEHIND THE MEN: Their various states of marriage, fidelity, motherhood, and fertility.
The women were the focus here. Who was married, single, engaged; which ones had children, were pregnant, or wanted to be pregnant; and lastly, who had cheated who did not. Curiously, every one of these women has a different story and not a single one is in the same boat as another.
Peggy: Single/Cheated with Pete/Recently gave birth/No children
Joan: Engaged/Cheated with Roger/no children
Rachel: Newlywed/Cheated with Don/?
Trudy: Married/No cheating/wants to be pregnant
Betty: Married/No Cheating/2 children
Bobby: Married/Cheated with Don (and others?)/No children
Anita: Married/No cheating/Pregnant/2 children
New Secretary: Single...

To me, this is the subject matter that stood out the most in the show.

Don needs Betty more than she needs him

Don is completely dependent on the contructs of marriage and family life to serve as an anchor for his impulsive and volatile relationships with other women, not to mention the fact it's a safe place to be emotionally checked out, taking advantage of a woman who truly loves him. He'd be a wreck without Betty. He's a little boy without a clue what he's doing with any of them. It's all pounce and circumstance (hahaha). Both Betty and Don remind me of chilldren playing house but she may be the stronger of the two, regardless of what Dr. Wayne told Don. Given the motivation (like actually catching slick Dick in a lie) Betty might kick him to the curb, which isn't far from the gutter, which seems to be where he's headed. Of course, there is that one small fact they have two kids and Don supports them all....

Peggy's life reality or fantasy?

Hello to my fellow Maddicts out there! I am just now getting onto the computer, long day.
I haven't been able to read all of the comments yet, so I apologize if someone has already brought this up.
I had a thought go through my sleepy brain last night after the show.
What if Peggy's psychological problem is causing her to fantasize about her pregnancy, and Don visiting her in the hospital. There is a phenomenon called "hysterical pregnancy". A women will actally gain weight, have cravings, and experience labor type pain. What if she dreamed up the whole thing?
Something to think about...

This never happened.

Greetings, Maddicts. Here is my weekly review of this week's episode.

The theme was "This never happened." His relationship with Rachel? Never happened. Peggy in the hospital? Never happened. His accident? Never happened. Dick Whitman? Never happened. n I'm sure Ted Kennedy wishes he could apply the same to Chappaquiddick! Which, by the way, is what I thought was going to happen when Bobbie asked Don if he liked bridges.

Shocking moments for me: Anita is pregnant! The whole zipper scene with Freddy - ROTFLMAO! Don to Bobbie: "I don't feel a thing." Rachel in the restaurant and she's married to a total dweeb who I'm sure Daddy likes. Don called Peggy to bail him out. Don visiting Peggy in the hospital. Peggy calling him Don (you go, girl!).

I didn't like that Peggy stayed home with Bobbie vs. going to work. That really didn't make sense to me. I expected Bobbie to give her a makeover and I sense one coming soon as Peggy begins to assert herself. Bobbie had some very interesting lines: "Pick a job and then become the person who does it," and Don's response: "That's true." To Peggy: "You have to start living the life of the person you want to be." I think Bobbie and Joan have a lot in common when it comes to using the power of being a woman. I liked how Bobbie negotiates everything and she even said she did it once in a department store - this right after Rachel walked by. The contrast between Bobbie and Peggy was great - Bobbie thinks she's so smart and in charge yet Peggy is even more so. It's very similar to the dynamic between Peggy and Joan. Bobbie and Joan know how to be women - Peggy is trying to learn to be a man, which Bobbie said she can't do.

Why did Don join Bobbie after saying no to her? He mentioned a foreign film to her - "La Notte?" Big question - does Don know Peggy had a baby? Does he know it's Pete's? I'm guessing yes and yes. But, then again, it never happened.

Peggy is growing balls. I loved her line to Don in the car: "I don't want you treating me badly because I remind you of it." I was also very proud of her reminding Don about the $110. His response: "I guess when you try to forget something you forget everything." I'll bet he does.

I could say a lot about the Pete/Trudy/infertility story line. I'm an infertility survivor and I know firsthand what that is like. I think the portrayal is real. Men don't get how much of a woman's identity can be tied into wanting a baby. Pete simply doesn't see it. All he knew is that his sperm had superhuman powers and his manhood was secured. End of story. As far as him having to do something very private in a public place, all I can say is that he got to be alone and he got off - nothing about what Trudy will go through will be private nor pleasurable.

Speaking of which, great transition from Pete in the stall with a dirty magazine to Roger and the paddle ball! I loved Roger's line: "the story of relatively young love." I think he loved Joan in his Roger way. I give them credit for acknowledging it and not pretending that it never happened.

Someone needs to check a map of Long Island

Mad Men is my favorite show, but STONY BROOK IS NOT ON THE OCEAN. This was a colossal error for a show that prides itself on accuracy. I accepted that Bobbi was drunk when asking if Don liked the Ocean and stating she had a place out in Stony Brook. But then to go on about the crashing surf. The Long Island Sound has no crashing surf, and it didn't have it in 1962 either. Someone fire the stylist...