they killed gene off too soon

Yes, they did. Just when Sally and Bobby had someone finally paying some attention to them, Grandpa Gene died. Excellent actor in the role, too.

Why does Betty hate her children?

no kidding why kill off Gene so soon?
& yeah Betty is one mean MOM...

First time commenter! First visit to the blog!

I am a bit sad to see him go... Grandpa Gene was starting to grow on me even if he did have a bone to pick with Don :)

I don't think Betty hates her kids personally as much as she hates having kids. She doesn't really dig the housewife life and it's trappings.She struck me as a big sister to her daughter or a babysitter rather than a mother hen. Kids are kind of a pain in the arse when someone like her wants to be free. ( Sorry mommies and daddies! You know that kids can be inconvenient no matter how much you love them - times of stress, when they won't cooperate, they get sick- ) At least she takes care of them and allows them to be normal and somewhat self sufficient which is better than what some parents do ( in either side of the spectrum!)

The oral contraceptive pill which we now take for granted was not in really wide use until about 1965 for married women and 1972 for unmarried women. Parenthood was not as much of a choice as it was a fact of life - if you married you will have kids and at least 3 to 5 of them! Nowadays it may be 2. Family planning back then was limited. Remaining Comstock laws made it hard to even get info about how to prevent pregnancy until it was struck down for married women in 1965 by the Supreme court. Women were stuck with kids unless they adopted them out :) Thank goodness that we have a choice now!

Don't fret folks, Gene is not dead! They didn't view the body yet and find out it was the other Gene at the bank. We'll probably see him in bed down in Florida with the second wife cuddling after great make-up sex. Ooops, hope I don't get my buddy in their editing department in trouble.

Very true agentsarahjane! I'm housewife and mom of 2, but my kids weren't born until 2003 and 2008. Kids can be a pain when a mom wants to be independent and free. I've seen many of my acquaintances not take too well to motherhood. I love my kids, but they can be a pain and I've chosen to have and take care of them, and I wouldn't trade places with anybody's life. My husband and kids are my life and love them dearly. (awww)

I can't remember the exact episode, but when Betty was talking to a friend about how she and Don met and married, the order was they started dating, got engaged, GOT PREGNANT, then got married. I can see where she can feel trapped. And with this pregnancy, feels even more so. I see post-partum depression in her future. BTW, the A&P is a grocery store.

I was also surprised that the news came back that Gene was dead so quickly. I think it very well be the real Gene. As my husband said, "What do you expect when you eat chocolate ice cream with salt?" Sally and Robert had really started to bond with their grandfather, which makes things sadder for them. Judging from the tease, Sally's going to have a rough road ahead of her. Remember the image on the TV when she watched the news, the monk that set himself on fire in Vietnam? I think that as time goes by, Sally's going to get caught up in the changes of the late 60's.

And, I have to say this, dear God, Jai-Lai (sp?) I remember this and if I remember correctly, it didn't take off very well. Sterling Cooper may take a hit from it.

Amen to agentsarahjane!!! :)

What's going on between Don & Peggy re: the Patio account? First there was the last scene in last week's episode where she went in to discuss it with him. Then this week, when she walked out of the meeting she threw him a glance. Not sure if I missed something, am reading into it too much, etc....

I agree on how Betty appears to be more of a big sister to her kids. But it's interesting though because parenting was so much different back then as opposed to how it is now. There was still some of the "children should be seen & not heard" practice back then. I was born in the early-60's and I really don't remember my parent's playing with me when I was young. I played with my younger brother, or spent time alone, then when I got older I played with friends -- but really can't remember doing things with my parents. And I would say I had a pretty good childhood and am I'm extremely close to my Mom now.

However Betty seems to be truly annoyed whenever her kids are less than perfect. And in general, Betty's just very childish and sometimes still wants to be treated that way (i.e., when she got upset with her father because he wanted to tell her about how he wanted things to be handled after he passed). And she just seems very unhappy with her life.

And I think you're right oldsoul555, Jai Alai didn't take off very well -- and it certainly didn't surpass baseball! I remember driving with the family to Florida as a kid & seeing signs for matches (or whatever they're called). Wow...talk about a blast from the past....

On a separate note....will be interested to see how Peggy & the new roomie mesh... talk about false advertising!

First timer as well for me! I do agree that Betty does not seem to like her children very well. So common of that day for women to feel trapped in their beautiful suburban surroundings. However, I think that last nights episode showed something beyond Betty just not liking her kids very well. What I saw was a beautifully accurate, and at the same time, extremely painful to watch portrayal of children being ignored of their grief. Poor Sally!! She is completely bereft with grief at her grandpa's passing and NOT one adult recognizes her true pain! What Sally was demonstrating at the end of the episode is called a grief burst. What the adults around the kitchen table saw was an unruly, disruptive child. But in reality, she was exhibiting her raw emotions in an age appropriate way. Thankfully, over the years, we have become a bit better in recognizing that children grieve differently than adults. I say kuddos to Matt Weiner for putting light on this subject! I want others to be more educated in the area of children's grief. If you want more info visit websites for Brooke's Place for Grieving Young People or the Dougy Center or look up the work of Dr. Alan Wolfelt.

I have been a huge fan of MadMen and I was truly delighted last night to see this story line. I am even a bigger fan now!!

Okay, my take: Betty was treated as "princess," a sort of doll, a baby, by her father who laments to Sally about protecting his daughter and not making her more independent and tough. In trying to make his child feel secure and loved, he managed to cripple her for life. She can't bear life unless it is perfect. She can't even comfort her father as he confronts death. She reminds him she's his little girl. That's what she wants to be, but she has grown up responsibilities and commitments -- very few of which she's handling like an adult.

Gene also realizes that Betty has married a man who is not what he seems to be; she's married an image of strength and power that she thinks will take care of her and provide for her in some idealized way.

Don is beginning to realize he's being used as a wallet and an emotional punching bag by his immature wife. His own lies and duplicity make it impossible for him to claim any control over the relationship.

This episode was all about the parent child relationship and its dependencies -- in both directions. Betty is a lousy mother because she wants to keep being Daddy's little girl. She transferred her dependence on her father to her dependence on her husband; Peggy is attempting to break loose from her controlling, obsessive mother (whose primary relationship with with the Holy Father!). The SC new client, the poor little rich boy with the delusions of jailai grandeur was the cautionary tale. You don't know what you're raising.

I have three kids myself and I worked full time their entire lives. My husband and I never sacrificed our careers for our kids, but we also refused to sacrifice our kids to our jobs. Each got a fair shake. It wasn't easy and the choices were hard, but on the whole, it worked. They're now all successful, responsible, reasonably content adults who don't have to bear the burden of having ruined their mother's life for the sake of some homemade cookies and or a custom sewn Halloween costume. That's what the liberation of the 60s gave women; my kids and I were its benefactors.

Betty isn't so lucky. Gene's message to Sally was don't grown up to be like your mother.

ovation246, peggy hated the whole patio commercial from the beginning. she tried to explain to the "boys" when they told her what the clients wanted. she then spoke to don about it. he blew her off. so that's why she was very smug when it didn't work. will don listen to her the next time she voices her opinion. watch "love among the ruins".
i love the way peggy describes ann-margaret as being 25 acting 14.

They like to kill off interesting characters. I was sad to see Don's brother go so soon. This keeps us in suspense as to who is next.

For me, the most interesting characters are Don, Betty and Roger. For reasons I cannot explain I continue to like them even when though they say and do some nasty things. The actors are awesome.

Matthew Weiner and his writing staff are so meticulous on re-creating the early 60's, so it was a bit of a shock for Peggy to reveal her Norwegian heritage while at the same time growing up Catholic. Norwegian Americans were and still are in the main Lutheran and a "mixed" marriage (i.e. Catholic & Protestant) was a big deal at that time. However, as with all the things left unsaid in this great series, I trust the creator and writers to sort this out in a way that heightens the arc of the story.

Edward, good point about Peggy's heritage.
I find Peggy in her mother's home to be very attractive and easy to like. At the office she is less attractive and secure. It looks like the writers were going for her 2 personalities.

I loved Gene's character. About Betty- I don't think she hates her kids. I am about Bobby's age and I can tell you that parents addressed their children a lot differently in the 60's than now. I so relate to Betty's "Go on. Get out of here." (paraphrased) an episode or so ago. The common approach to parenting was that "Children should be seen and not heard."

Does anyone happen to know who the doll is that sally was carrying on the porch when she hears grandpa passed away? I am so curious! Thanks! Loved this episode BTW!

Didn't anyone notice that Peggy couldn't come up a good ad for a roommate? She's a jr copywriter & couldn't even come up with a enticing ad that would catch the eye of a potential roommate. I think Joan is trying to help her find a good roommate in the hope she will bring some life to Peggy's robotic persona.

Yes I agree it was a little too soon to see Gene die. Those kids needed someone to show them some kind of attention. I was hoping Gene would go into one of his 'ugly episodes'& verbally take it out on Betty by expressing what a childish, pampered, un-loving mother she is. All the while, Sally & Bobby overhear from the next room....smiling at each other.

The character of Sal is getting very interesting. Too bad there's no way he can come out of the closet & still have a job. Can you imagine being a closet homosexual in 1962? And the repercussions if word got out? He would be ruined in advertising world. (Remember Freddie Rumsey? And he just urinated on himself.)

Of course it was Pete Campbell who brought the Freddie situation to the surface. Yet he hasn't said a word to Peggy about his own child being giving up for adoption. You'd think he use the baby as an excuse to talk to her & get some attention. On other note: Pete & Trudy are good dancer's! I enjoyed watching them dance @ Roger & Jane's wedding.

Joan was Peggy's first boss and showed her around the office on Day 1. She still has a strong influence on Peggy and they easily revert back to their former roles.

olhababy: I think the doll Sally was holding when she finds out her grandpa died is a 1961 Mattel Sister Bell doll. I've attached the link for you to look at: http://dollreference.com/images/sister_belle1961mattelb.jpg

Digger Donald: yes I recall Joan showing Peggy the ropes, I think its kind that she continues to try & guide her in the right direction.

Thanks summerbaby! I think your right! I had never seen one of those dolls before..cool!

anyone thinking maybe Gene is not reallly dead? Since they mention Gene 2, maybe Gene 1 is the one who really died and Gene is off wandering , forgetting where he is? Just a thought I had...Seemed suspicious that they threw that in there. I hope it is not him that passed- he keeps it very interesting there in the Draper home!

i think for sure gene #2 is dead. gene #1 and gene #2 bank in the same town far away from draper's. also betty was eating a peach from his car. it would quite a coincidence if gene# 1 died in the a&p where gene #2 left his lincoln. the whole idea is too dumb for mm's writers.
i think peggy made a big mistake listening to joan. i like that actress playing "roomie", she's from carnivale, one of the couchi dancers/whores. well the writers like to give us something we are not expecting maybe it will be good for peggy.
if peggy thought margaret was more adult why didn't she use that on her door.
god i hope betty gives birth soon she going to burst.
betty doesn't hate her kids she just being bitchy the way people are when they are miserable. she seems to be bonding with this next one maybe she'll be her favorite (if it isn't another boy, she doesn"t seem to like boys)

I hope I am not right about this one, but MW is not letting the Bye Bye Birdie motif go so here's what I think. Betty AKA Birdy is either going to leave Don and the kids (ala Happy Rockefeller) at the end of the season or she is going to be so fundamentally altered by the events of the season that we will not recognize her. Remember Gene referencing Don and saying "If you'd only known what was possible?" Also, I think she will get a key made and open that drawer. It is the only way she'll ever find out about Don's past.
Betty doesn't really hate the kids; she hates her life, and she cannot forget Don's double betrayal-first with Dr. Wayne and then with Bobbie Barrett.

ust a note on the Norwegian Catholic thing: Norway banned Roman Catholicism after the Lutheran Reformation but lifted the prohibition in the mid 19th century. The RC church has been active there since, but the number of Norwegian Catholics is small and, it's likely that in the early 20th century, they were marginalized. This would provide a good reason to emigrate to the U.S. for more religious tolerance and opportunity.

I don't think Betty thinks enough about her kids to hate them. She's more involved in her own misery and the misery of her fractured marriage to pay much attention to either Bobby or Sally. In most respects, they seem to be an annoyance and a distraction from her efforts to construct a "perfect life." I think her close relationship with her neighbor's child, Glen Bishop, was created to show that her emotional age is pre-pubescent. She doesn't hate kids, it's just that she's still one herself!

And like a child, she doesn't feel capable of changing reality, only being frustrated when her fantasies don't become reality. Betty married the best looking guy in the room. What she wanted was good sex (remember the episode when she tells Don it's what she thinks about all day?). After that, she had no clue what an adult marriage could or should be. Can you imagine being married to someone who refuses to tell you anything about their family or early life? How could you marry someone who trusts you so little that confiding such basic information would be off limits? Betty is clearly a prop in Don's do-it-yourself life; and he's also one in the life she's fantasized for herself. It's all one big advertising campaign. The question: Who's buying it?

Sad to see Gene go. Demented as he was, he saw Don for what he is -- a fake. And he saw the potential in Sally, something he failed to do with his own daughter. He did however see it in his wife, who worked for an engineer who was "a bald guy. No threat." Yes, women who worked were in peril of being seduced by other, more powerful, more talented men...that's why it's such a threat for women to work. Their men might lose control. I suspect we'll see Dr. Greg try to control his wife this way (he already started when she was reading scripts for Harry and not forgetting to bring him his glass of water!) The chief surgeon's wife was the voice of experience: Don't get pregnant. What she knew that pregnant women couldn't work back then, most were fired once they started to "show." The surgeon's wife knew that money is power in a relationship. A stay at home wife could be more easily controlled by her husband because she had no recourse if things got bad.

Conservative religious sects (Muslim, Christian and Jewish) all discourage women from working outside the home because it threatens the supremacy of the husband; and guarding one's "property" is the subliminal fear of men whose wives have autonomy and relationships outside the home. Both Joan and Betty are examples of women who believe they need men to validate their lives; I'll be interested to see if Betty inherits much money from her father and how that may change her relationship with Don.

Also: Has everyone here noticed that we have a "new" Bobby Draper? The cute little guy who played the part for the first two seasons, Aaron Hart, seems to have been dumped for a new kid, Jared Gilmore. Not sure I like the casting change...what do you guys think?

I'm glad someone found out the name of at least one the actors who play D&B's kids. I still can't find the name of the little girl who plays Sally. I did however want to comment on how good she did in Episode 4! And disappointed that her name along with Jared Gilmore isn't listed or acknowledged as one of the actors on this website.....shame on you AMCTV!

I was recently at my parents house & have always noticed (what I thought were) tacking drinking glasses that had a skull & cross-bones on them. My thought has always been that my mom must have gotten them at a garage sale so when I was there, I asked my dad about them. He nonchalantly said that my mom has had those glasses for years, so having my blackberry close by & because I was a little bored, I decided to try & find them on google. Those glasses are worth $350.00 for a set of 6! I wish my mom were still alive, she would have gotten a kick out of that. All my dad does is smile & say 'oh really? That much?' She died earlier this year. I see a lot of things on MadMen that make me think of my mother. If anyone is interested, take a look at these glasses: http://www.moodindigonewyork.com/p3/barware/glassware_html/briard_old_fasioned_poison_glasses.html

Georges Briard NAME YOUR POISON Double Old Fashioned Glasses, Set of Six4 1/4" high x 4" wide

These large-sized old fashioned glasses were designed by Georges Briard in the 1960's. Each glass is decorated in black and gold with a skull and crossbones, Rx symbols, a revolver, mortar and pestle and crossed knives. Each is marked "Name Your Poison" with a particular poison highlighted in a box of black with gold highlights. Those poisons included in this set are: Arsenic, Potassium Cyanide, Strychnine, Carbolic Acid, Paris Green and Nitroglycerine. Excellent condition.

$350.00 set of 6

beverlyc the actress who play sally draper is kiernan shipka
i think she's wonderfull. click on interviews at the main menu to find one with her.
the actor who played bobby last season (i'm not sure who played him in the 1st. somewhere i read this is the 3rd bobby) was to young or will be soon as they like to skip ahead. next season may skip 1964 all together. i' hope so anyway. i want to see how these characters deal with the coming changes in the culture, mainly womens lib and also gay lib, black lib, little suburbian children lib, we don't want your f#%$#ing war lib.

by the way beverlyc, do you ever use imdb search to find actors names? it very helpful. check it out.

ooops the last two messages should have been for summerbaby7 not beverlyc, sooo sorry, joan would have fired me in a ny minute

Thank you jh! I tried under Cast & Characters but got frustrated when I wasn't having any luck. Yes, your right, there have been a few Bobby's. I believe even MW has even had his own daughter play Sally in an episode or two at the beginning of the show. Well, there in still 1963 & the big one is coming up, November 22nd, the Kennedy assassination. And for some reason, I was thinking that was the day Roger said either he & Jane or his daughter was suppose to get married. Anyway, yes it will be interesting to see how all the upcoming historical events will change (or not) the character's - only time will tell.

i found the name of the first seasons bobby,maxwell huckabee. didn't his dad run for president?
roger's daughters wedding is set for nov 23, 1963, the day after jfk is shot. i remember that weekend (i was the age that sally is, nine) everyone was glued to the tv. i may have seen oswald shot live or at the least a very instant replay.
i kinda wish they started this season with the assassination but i guess this way makes for better drama. it will likely be the last episode or since the writer likes to give us what we are not expecting maybe the bullet misses him and kills ladybird instead. that would be crap with no one to beautify america

I think that Betty lives in a state of emotional denial. She doesn't like to be confronted with the tough and real parts of life. Like I stated on another blog. In Season 1 she had not dealt with her mother's death. In Season 2 she did not want to face her father's illness. It was her nanny that had to tell her to grow up (not in a mean way). She like most women had a feeling Don was cheating, but when it was confirmed she fell apart, she didn't know how to deal with it. She does the mothering thing physically but emotionally she doesn't know how to deal with her kids or doesn't want to. She didn't want to deal with the thought of her father dying and making arrangements. She's like a little girl, pretty much what the doctor picked up on in Season 1.

I think Betty and Don are like most of us. . .we don't like what we have, but we really don't know what it is exactly that we do want. I don't think Don knows what he wants. Part of me believes that he loves Betty, but is not in love with her. . .but at the same time I think, maybe he IS in love with her, and that's the whole problem. In the flashback scene with Anna last season, he was so giddy talking about Betty and how he felt about her. I believed it. The letter he wrote to Betty in his hotel room when they were separated, call me a fool, but I believed it. Maybe he just missed the option of having a family to come home to, I don't know. He has never experienced real love (except from his brother and Anna), so I don't think he knows what to do with it.

No I've never use imdb but I'll give a whirl - thanks for the tip. You're right again, November 23rd not the 22nd. Personally, I'm glad they started the show in 1960, it wouldn't have given the audience enough time to get to know the characters & their flaws. I feel this way, you wonder how the characters will react. For example: I can't see Paul reacting the same why Sal or Duck would. Speaking of Duck....where is he?? I like his character & the actor, has a Johnny Carson persona to him. But I was disappointed when he let his dog go, made me have 2nd thoughts about ol' Ducky. I'm over that now.

My last reply was for jh.....

summerbaby7
i like the first season starting in 1960 too. if for no other reason but for the fashion and it's fun to see it change.
i meant i was expecting them to skip more months from the end of 2nd season to beginning of 3rd. they skipped all of 1961. i was thinking maybe they were going to start the 3rd just before the assassination and end it with the beatles on ed sullivan in feb 1964. just something in my head. i'm fine with the way they are doing it. i am happy to along for the ride.
i feel the same as you re duck and actor. he reminded me of gig young in "teachers pet". poor gig young.
nice chatting with you

It was a good episode, I was kind of shocked when the cop said that Gene passed away, I was just thinking that maybe he was picked up "wandering around" and that they had him down at the station, but no, just like that, bam! dead Gene( you'll be missed, est 1895-1963) I did kind of like him, although he was a Lincoln man.

I did notice an error the third time I saw the show, when Sally is driving Gene's 1961 Continental in the beggining, you can clearly see that the gear lever is in Park, they should have had it down in neutral or something, so that it could not be seen. I was surprised that they used one of the newer "smaller" Continentals as Genes car, I would have picked one of the bigger 1960 and older cars, it "fits" Gene better, he was obviously retired, so he might have not bought a new car for a few years, but I guess that the 1961 Lincoln was already 2 years old at the time that this took place in 1963.

Thanks jlh for the insight on Don/Peggy & the Patio ad. Makes total sense as she really was opposed to what they were doing from the start, and, didn't even like the name.

I thought the most interesting aspect of the Patio ad was that Peggy and Don clashed over how they should approach their target audience -- women who want to stay slim by drinking diet soda. Don's approach is traditional: You sell to women by showing them something men want -- Ann Margret. Women want to be what men want, so they buy the product associated with Ann Margret. (He even says, "Peggy, you know how this works.")
Peggy believes the ad should feature something women actually want for themselves. This is two generations that are radically opposed -- Don sees women vessels for the desires of men, Peggy believes women have their own wants and needs independent of men's desires. Ophelia, where for art thou Ophelia.

Has anyone consider that Don is the not father of Betty's third baby. Unless I missed something didn't her encounter with the stranger at the hotel happened before she got pregnant?

No, she was already pregnant when she had the bar tryst. It was after she'd been to the doctor, contemplated an abortion, confided in her friend Francine and gone horseback riding (against the doctor's orders, no doubt to try and cause a miscarriage.) She's come to realize that getting rid of the baby is too difficult, so she'll have to go back to Don -- but she's gonna get even with him first. The bar pick up was her retaliation.

The last sexual encounter we see Don and Betty have is at her father's house, a week or so before he leaves for California (after which he disappeared for three weeks.) He and Betty reconciled shortly after his return in mid October shortly after she visited the doctor and got the news that she was pregnant. The end of Season 2, his return and their reconciliation, was mid October 1962 (around Oct. 14 was when Kennedy went on TV to say stepped up reconnaissance had spotted missile bases being built) as the Cuban crisis was coming to a head. By my calculations, Betty got pregnant in mid-September of 1962, so she'd be due to deliver in mid June 1963. This week's episode was June 11, so we can expect a baby Draper any episode now.