Ok, that whole panty thing was disturbing. My goodness, today that secretary would get millions for her sexual harassment lawsuit. I hope that Kennedy wins before the episode is done. Don't leave us hangin'! You know Betty just might cry. A catholic in the White house. Perish the thought.

HA! That secretary's name would be in front of Sterling's and Cooper's on the door if that happened today.

Ken, is as unstable as Pete apparently, based upon;

A- The altercation with Pete;

B- The near altercation in episode 11, after comments about the vibrator;

C- The "panty" fiasco;

This guy could be a "time bomb"!!!

Posted the following earlier:

Ken in my initial observation added very little substance to the program. However, Ken's remarks about Peggy and the ensuing altercation(with Pete) has added a degree of substance to his character. There is something about Ken, he has rough "edges", that are surfacing. Could he be from a similiar economic background as Don, without the "polish".

Someone commented about Roger becoming religious - very good possibility!!!

There is much more to Adam's suicide than loneliness and depression. Clue's are in the "shoe box", Pete pilfered.

Pete will definitely blackmail Don with the package from Adam, although I think we will have to wait until next year to find out what's in it! Don is going to do everything in his power to make sure Pete does not advance until of course, the package comes into play - and it will! I hope the Rachel/Don things ends with her jumping out a window or soemthing; that relationship is boring to watch! Even their scenes in bed are one big drag! Peggy had better get off of The Pill before she ends up the size of a house! And whatever happened to Midge, Don's mistress in the Village? I thought their relationship had more interest than does the Rachel aspect. And poor Betty! That woman is so clueless, emotionally stunted, and infantile it's not funny. It seems as though her emotional growth ended about age 15! It also seems Don expects her psychiatrist to make her into more of a Stepford Wife than she is already! And he seems to be generally puzzled as to why she isn't gloriously happy! Their marriage was over a long time ago and now they are merely going through the motions. As for that scene where Ken chases down one of the women at the agency and "tackles" - then hikes up her dress - today that female worker would file a lawsuit and own Sterling Cooper instead of rather happily walking off arm and arm with Ken after the incident. That scene was distasteful to say the least.

I agree that a lawsuit would probably have been filed if Ken's panty raid happened today.

Back then... I suspect there was a challenge by the secretary that we didn't see. I watched her expression as he was chasing her. Like a high school girl being chased by a guy she likes. Which is why they ended by going off arm in arm.

I agree, the secretary seems to actually like Ken and his attention. They had probably both had several drinks by this time of the (victory) party.

Also back then, women had such bad options - she either takes it stride by taking his arm and is judged a whore by some or she walks off indignantly and she would be judged a bitch by others.

What does Don want from Betty? He tells her about being partner and she's very excited for him and wants to hug him and he's a cold brick or should I say "prick".

She acts like a child because he treats her like one. He doesn't even try to have a life with her.

Rachel, I agree is a total bore. I hope that ends soon.

I can't wait for Pete's wife to find out more creepy stuff about her husband. I don't think she will like it that he is stealing Don's mail even if it helps him at work. She made the mistake of assuming he was a respectable person before they were married.

That panty ending was something that used to happen in middle school. Stupid!

Does anyone know if the show was picked up and if/when it will return for a new season?

Rachel is the bomb and their scenes are so not boring if you understand how to read them. Her whole comment on how "this is hard for me more so because I can't imagine how hard it is for you" shows she actually cares for Don and he can actually look her in the eyes when talking to her. Midge was boring because all it was about was sex and Rachel is hot.

Oh yes, this is terribly hard for Don! I guess Rachel wouldn't know that cheating on his wife is about as hard as breathing.

Oh yes, this is terribly hard for Don! I guess Rachel wouldn't know that cheating on his wife is about as hard as breathing.

I like the Don & Rachel gig...A LOT !!!

"Oh yes, this is terribly hard for Don! I guess Rachel wouldn't know that cheating on his wife is about as hard as breathing."

That shows something about that relationship doesn't it.

Just another thought:

I find it interesting that when Don was cheating on Betty with Midge he would still have sex with her but now that he's with Rachel she has to resort to the washing machine. At least Betty was getting some action before poor thing.

Rachel's fabulous! She's glamorous and has fantastic nails! Anyway, it's obvious Don refuses to cheat on Rachel with Betty....Goes to show his intensity of feeling with Rachel.

AJ above hit the nail on the head. Don's emotionally attached to Rachel to the point that he doesn't want to sleep with his wife. It's a much different relationship than the one he had with Midge. Don probably never really loved Betty. She was the "kind of wife" a "man like him" was supposed to have, so he married her.

you gotta love Pete's crack about false weightloss claims!

I think Don has more of an emotional connection with Rachel. Remember when he told her about his mother and past family life? I seriously started crying. He obviously feels they are soul mates. I don't know how she 'feels' about him. I think she is very enormously attracted to him - I know I am (hee hee).

Does Betty known all about his past?? She does act very childish - almost like she is a newlywed, but they have two school age children. Anyone else agree?

I still feel Don and Rachel's sexual scenes are awkward.

Maybe they'll find out they're really brother and sister!!!

Peggy has a plan, so gaining weight was not an accident. Joan's strategies don't appeal to her. Peggy has a brain. And she's surreptitiously climbing the ranks, using excess weight as camouflage. That way, the men won't see her as a threat or a sexual object. Sterling Cooper is slowly becoming dependent on her feminine point of view to get and keep accounts. Once Nixon loses,

Peggy stand to gain even more importance. The book she was reading in bed - was it an Ayn Rand novel?

THis is by far the best show on TV. It is not advertised enough and most people I talk to do not know about this show. It is so well written and acted and so well done. It beats any of the other new shows that have been hyped. They pale compared to this one. I have enjoyed each and every show and find it so smartly written, and directed. Can hardly wait to watch it every week. I hope that it goes on and on and it should win an emmy.

i missed it thurs night, but can't find it on iTunes yet. anyone else find it online?

And what happened to the divorcee neighbor with the weird kid? She seems to have vanished.

BTW, I don't think The Pill was around before 1965.

Most people I talk to don't even know this show exists. A shame -- it indeed should have been publicized quite a bit more.

Kobe56,

In a previous episode Joan gave Peggy her Dr's name that prescribed birth control, and it showed Peggy go and get on them.

1960

The Searle drug company receives FDA approval for Enovid - the first birth control pill. "The Pill" revolutionizes contraception. It's 100% effective -- but has terrible side effects, including life-threatening blood clots. Eventually it's realized that the dose is 10 times too high.

http://www.webmd.com/content/article/71/81244.htm

Visan -

I don't think Don is refusing to cheat on Rachel by having sex with Betty. I think it's more along the lines that the house is hot and his, ahem, needs have already been satisfied. Trust me, if Rachel was in Europe on a buying trip in a cool month, Betty would be taking care of his "needs". I will say he and Rachel seem to be much closer emotionally than he and Betty.

Betty is the blonde goddess like Grace Kelly, the woman he had placed on a pedestal, the mother of his children. Rachel isn't and Midge wasn't.

I watched the episode again last night (thanks be to DirecTV's DVR). Don got on the phone to the shrink that evening AFTER Betty deliberately refrained from hugging him for his promotion to partner. He complained to the doctor that she'd been sent for a nervous complaint and now, after several hundred dollars in sessions, she was weaker, not stronger.

The doctor responded that she could go for psychoanalysis for up to five days a week. Don, who's given that kind of pitch before, doesn't believe that will solve the problem. Not that he ever did but he was willing to give it a shot.

In spite of shooting off the BB gun/air rifle a couple of weeks ago, Betty's not putting her foot down and insisting the kids need A/C. (Yeah, she needs it more but she shouldn't put it that way.) He doesn't know it, but she's sometimes in her nightdress through the morning. Her only genuine relationship is with their neighbor, Francine, who's got higher priorities (new baby) these days. Time to organize a bridge club, dear. Right now Betty's an affair waiting for a partner.

I love the picture of Joan and Sal as a preview to Episode 12. There's something about seeing those two together that just seems right. ;)

I love the picture of Joan and Sal as a preview to Episode 12. There's something about seeing those two together that just seems right. ;)

I watched the director and actors talk about the filming of Mad Men and the early 60's cultural context of the series. The director of this excellent show is right some situations have indeed remained the same even until this day. I worked in large corporate legal firms in Boston in the 1970's up to 2004. In very similar ways I can relate to a corporate environment which spanned decades. Much was like the machinations of the Sterling Cooper firm.

In one of my first comments about the series I sanctimoniously breathed a sigh of relief that thankfully I was working and living at a time in which those types of behaviors would not be sanctioned. The director, however, says yes, things changed but they also remained the same. This too is true. Still, I do believe profound changes have occurred so that heretofore powerless people now have at least SOME recourse.

Talk shows such as Oprah and many others make the once psychologically cornered person know that they are not alone and that they can exert at least some control to change their condition. The huge difference between the eras, I believe, is that we are allowed to at least TALK about things that heretofore were taboo. In the era of the late 50's and early 60's in which I grew up there was little talk or just a hint of talk but only on a psychiatrist's or analyst's couch which had just become fashionable and only for the well-to-do. Certainly there was not much introspection among persons in authority. Most definitely powerful men had to answer to nearly no one. Questioning authority is not the exception now it is the rule. Some of the absolutely vile, impertinent and condescending comments of those powerful men at Sterling Cooper towards especially the powerless women they work, have sex and live with would not fly. The courts are flooded with discrimination suits which attest to that fact.

While it is true human beings are human beings at all times, the social metamorphosis of the late 60's which encompassed the women's movement, the black movements, homosexuals and the like have given at least some voice and power over those strictly white men who once upon a time had usurped it all. Best of all at least in Boston one can barely find a place to smoke. That change saved lives.

I absolutely adore this show. It am transfixed!

I really enjoy the show. I normally just watch FOX or CNN. I have not engaged in appointment tv since "Frasier" or "Law & Order" with Logan & Orbach.

I am so happy I was not living during that time. I am a black woman. I cannot imagine having to be a maid and not have a college education. It would be a curse to be black and a woman during that time. I am so reminded of this each time I watch this show.

I am so grateful to all the people men, women, black, white and every shade in between who fought for me to have the same opportunity to achieve a wonderful life. (+:

When will Don finally buy an air conditioner? He got a nice bonus (which he gave to free-spirt Midge), he got a big bump in pay, and now he is a partner. What's with the suffering and sweating?

Peggy is gaining weight (much of it water weight) because of The Pill. back then, The Pill had just come onto the market and it was way too strong and carried many more dangerous side-effect than the modern BC Pill. The Pill puts a woman in a state of pseudo-pregnancy (water weight gain, additional poundage, etc.) and this is why poor Peggy is beginning to look like a blimp! She is not actually pregnant as so many have speculated in the past. Also, The Pill came along well before 1965 as another poster suggested, but again, it had not been perfected as it is today. There are still risks even with the modern Pill. Pete is his usual un-charming self and his desperate desire to get ahead really shows. Nothing wrong with getting ahead, of course, but he ought to see the handwriting on the wall; as long as Draper is around, Pete doesn't stand a chance of advancement (unless of course he can find a way to blackmail Don with the package from Adam - or a guy who somewhat resembled Adam). As far as Don and Rachel, their relationship leaves me stone cold; there just does not seem to be any chemistry there at all. He has more with Betty and precious little with her at that! Poor Betty Draper is caught in the 1960s Suburban Housewife Trap that so many women found themselves in back then: Nice house, nice clothes, a couple of kids, white-collar husband, wine, cigarettes, gossiping with a neighbor, cooking, cleaning and making dinner...and not much else. I think Betty will finally rebel or go completely off the wall! You can see the pressure is building both inside her and externally. As for Joan, something tells me that she swings both ways but has not yet come to terms with the fact, just like the guy at the agency (can't recall his name, although I think he swings only one way). After all, it's the sixties and homosexuality (and really, all talk and/or acknowledgement of sex - other than actually engaging in it was off limits). The things we all talk about openly today were just not discussed in the sixties; it was considered unseemly and in poor taste to discuss sex, birth control, pregnancy, homosexuality, and emotional feelings in general. I was a kid back then and I remember my parents having cocktail parties but believe me, everyone trod the straight and narrow at least as far as discussing anythng more than the weather or their jobs, kids, etc. People were not as politically-inclined back then either; that type of awareness really began (slowly) in the Kennedy vs Nixon debates. Anyway, I think Roger will eventually exit the show with the writers doing him in (but nothing predictable), and I think one of the creative team will be promoted into a fairly high position but it won't surely won't be Pete. Pete's wife will eventually make a reappearance and it won't be pretty when she does. Ken will knock-up someone, marry her, and eventually leave to become a full-time writer. Con will tell Cooper (the Robert Morse character) of his past and foil Pete's blackmail attempts. In fact, something tells me that Cooper has a few skeletons in his closet too, it's just that because of his age, appearance, and rank (owner and full partner) no one bothers with that sort of thing where he is concerned, as it would be pointless and not nearly as titillating as the affairs of Don Draper.

Fallingleaves,

I like and for the most part concur with your analysis of MM thus far. I find the on screen coupling of Don and Rachael dull and lifeless...for one this though I think Don is one of the finest (physically attractive) men alive..I don't think that he has the capacity for love....he considers Betty and his children property/props though he does have a certain level of care and affection for them; Rachael is his new "antedote for lonliness" as Midge once referred to herself. He is temporarily in "lust" with her...these two have enough emotional baggage between the two of them to fill steamer trunks ...both surviving children of mothers who died in childbirth- I am sure there is more than a bit of self inflicted guilt there; Rachael the younger daughther of a self made man who really had expected a son to leave his department store legacy to but got her instead.I think they displayed an amazing lack of vison about their store and resented being shown the vision Don had for it...but I digress.

Don seems caught between his WASP princess in the suburbs and his Jewish American Princess in Manhattan...both women are serious Daddy's girls. I actually think that Betty will leave Don because she is beginning to tire of being Don's prop/property ..

I doesn't make good sense for Don to be maintainig a sexual relationship with a client...at some point Rachael will be hurt and could decide to pull the account as a consequence

I think very soon Rachael will tell the truth of her affair with Don to her sister and that will cause an irrerapable (sp) split in their relationship.

Rachel fizzled for me - there is no chemistry with her and Don - End of Story

I think you're all wrong about Don and Rachel. They have tons of chemistry and a deep emotional connection and that's where the story is headed. There is much to be left to the imagination, if you actually have one. Don is different with Rachel. His emotional range is completely different from the shallow connection he had with Midge and the even more shallow one he has with Betty.

I'm not going to give any pompous suppositions about what will happen like so many posters already have, but I will say that any obvious solutions like Don leaving Betty or Betty leaving Don are completely ridiculous and not likely to happen. The writers aren't stupid. They've taken it this far and will likely continue to take it in a direction that none of us will predict. I'm thankful for that.

Cherbourg: Your welcome...I am an african american woman who was active in the later part of the civil/human rights movement and have many friends who were far more active...

What I find interesting is your comment that you suppose maids had no college education...I think that folks assume the elevlator, janitors, waiters, and bathroom attendants were of limited education. And that is the real tradgey of the late 50s and 60s...many of the black women and men that held service level jobs had not only one college degree but quite often and advanced degree and could not progress in their chosen professsion because of discrimination. I hope that in the second season of this program they deal with elevating one of the silent black characters to at least an entry level position in Sterling Cooper....

Betty won't be leaving Don anytime soon, even if she discovers a) his background or b) his affair with Rachel.

She has a horror of being divorced, being without a husband. Remember her discussions about Helen with Francine and later her description of Helen with the shrink? Helen's a much stronger woman than Betty.

Hmm, I wonder if the day of the birthday party when Helen was standing next to Don that Betty got worried about the classic "sexually aggressive divorcee." Which is why she immediately sent Don to get the cake. Midge might (probably) not have been his first affair. Not that Don would have had one with any woman she'd know. He's very good at compartmentalizing.

"Hmm, I wonder if the day of the birthday party when Helen was standing next to Don that Betty got worried about the classic "sexually aggressive divorcee." Which is why she immediately sent Don to get the cake. Midge might (probably) not have been his first affair. Not that Don would have had one with any woman she'd know. He's very good at compartmentalizing."

Ritt, I totally agree. Not only is he good at compartmentalizing, Don doesn't respond to sexually aggressive women (Joan, the young women in the bar, Midge calling him at work, the twins with Roger). He likes to do the chasing on his own terms. I think someone else said here that it's all about the hunt for him. He likes to be in control.

TJ writes:

I love the picture of Joan and Sal as a preview to Episode 12. There's something about seeing those two together that just seems right. ;)

TJ - I agree! I noticed that picture and the significant look passing between them. Joan is the one character savvy enough to possibly figure out Sal's secret. I wonder if they'll enter into "an arrangment?" It could benefit them both.

"And that is the real tradgey of the late 50s and 60s...many of the black women and men that held service level jobs had not only one college degree but quite often and advanced degree and could not progress in their chosen professsion because of discrimination."

Yup. There were ways around that mess. Going back to teach at an HBCU (historically-black college or university) was one. Confining your services to the black community in whatever city you were in was another (a choice that worked for self-employed types like lawyers or doctors.) But access to mainstream jobs was slim-to-none.

>I hope that in the second season of this program they deal with elevating one of the silent black characters to at least an entry level position in Sterling Cooper....

My bet is the young elevator operator Don paid off to pretend the elevators weren't working. He and Don have a real rapport--and he has the same kind of charm/salesmanship vital to an ad man...

Deering....I'm with you that Hollis, I think that's the elevator operator's name, seems to be on friendly terms with Don. It would be cool to see how the writers would approach such a storyline. It's one I'd love to see next season.

There is something definitely going on with Don and Rachel. I believe that Don hasn't shared any of his past life with Betty. I'm wondering what the connection is between Rachel and Don, besides sex? Is it because she's Jewish? Maybe Don is too. I'm looking forward to the development of this relationship.

I think that Don sees Betty as the "perfect" trophy wife and mother. He never had much of a mother, so she's his fantasy of what a mother should be.

Pete will certainly blackmail Don with the contents of the box. I can only imagine what's inside.

What about the gay character in the ad agency? I forgot his name? He turned down a man from out of town. There were many men "in the closet." I hope they explore his character with greater depth.

Diva wrote about Don: "I don't think that he has the capacity for love....he considers Betty and his children property/props though he does have a certain level of care and affection for them."

Awesome comment. And awesome reading about your life, too, and the lives of all the posters who have chosen to tell us a bit of their history. Please continue! It's fascinating to me!

When I read what you wrote about many blacks having college degrees but being forced to work in service jobs, a memory flashed into my head from 1966, which fills me with deep guilt and sorrow.

At that time my family was living in Nashville, Tennessee, before finally settling in Connecticut. I don't know why, but for a time we had a "maid" (a black woman) who would come a few days a week while my mother was out somewhere. I don't know the details because I was only five. But I do remember that she was referred to as "the maid."

Once, and only once as I recall, my mother drove her home in the late afternoon. I was so shocked and horrified when we arrived at her house in the middle of nowhere, on a mud road, that I remember this with crystal clarity: Her house was a literal SHACK, constructed of miscellaneous pieces of tin and plywood, more like a lean-to than a house.

There were several of this type of house on that road, with children outside playing and some chickens walking around the dirt yards.

My mother wanted to get out of there quickly after the "maid" got out of the car, and made us kids lock the doors as we drove off.

I tried to ask Mom some questions about the enormity of it all, because I just had never seen people living like that, but she refused to talk about it.

I don't think the "maid" worked for us very long after that.

What a sad, sad memory. It made me want to cry then and it makes me want to cry now.

I, too, thank all those who worked tirelessly and dangerously during the Civil Rights movement of the 60's.

It's been a quiet week in Lake Quonnipaug.

Two people tried to check out "Atlas Shrugged" at the local library. No copies were available.

A neighbor with satellite TV mentioned that he had seen Robert Morse, "How to Succeed in Business.......", on one of the channels. Happy to hear he is acting again.

By the way, will the person who borrowed my "Good Vibrations" by the "Beach Boys" please return it.

Deering, I was thinking the same thing about the elevator operator..he definately caught the nauance of what Don was up to and I thought then.."wonder what his back story is" ..I have all kinds of stories I could weave about him.

I find it interesting to hear of the disinterest/apathy toward Rachael. I find her character glamorous, and interesting. I loved it in the first episode when she refused to allow them to condescend to her..."A coupon?!" I liked the way she tactfully, but directly confronted them about the anit-semetic, and sexist attitudes they were conveying. In subsequent episodes, the conversations she has with her sister about what is going on are so well written, and acted. I think Rachael is sophisticated, frustrated, and slightly jaded with a sense of fashion that is first rate! I almost wish she hadn't given in to Don when he arrived unannounced, but then we might not have gotten the juicy details to add to what little we know of his mysterious past.

As if that weren't enough, there's so much good stuf about this show...I could go on all day, and can't get enough. It will kill me to have to wait so long for season two!

I think Rachel has quite a number of fans on this blog! I'm gladly, proudly one of them. She's gorgeous, glamorous and smart. As for her giving into Don, can't say I'd blame the woman! She'd been working hard and needed to blow off some steam!;)

Danny B, Don could have done the bit'o'self-revelation thing with Rachel, WITHOUT that boring, anti-climactic bed scene. Think of it: A closed-off guy like him just plain liking Rachel enough to meet heart-to-heart, without the rushed and cliched need for genital-to-genital. That would have been much, much more interesting.

Danny B, Don could have done the bit'o'self-revelation thing with Rachel, WITHOUT that boring, anti-climactic bed scene. Think of it: A closed-off guy like him just plain liking Rachel enough to meet heart-to-heart, without the rushed and cliched need for genital-to-genital. That would have been much, much more interesting.

Why is it that Rachel couldn't have just wanted to get laid in that moment?! Don comes a-callin' to rock out with his cock out and after some resistance, she handled business. Evidently, he knew how to put it down, with her lighting up literally and figuratively. Don was the one getting all Albert Camus/existential after!

I agree that Rachel's a great character and I like the relationship moving forward with Don. It probably won't last or end well, but at least we're seeing a different side of Don, thanks to how he his with Rachel.

On a completely different note, I found this link to a site that shows all the fab locations in Mad Men and thought I'd share it with all my MadMen buddies out there. Enjoy!

http://gridskipper.com/travel/new-york/the-mad-men-guide-to-new-york-303616.php

I wouldn't give up on poor little Betty just yet. She has another side to her that is just waiting to get out. Rachel will be the one to shut Don down. She is a strong business woman and knows what she wants and she won't have anything but a triss with Don. Spot on about Peggy packing the pounds on for power. She just may get the promotion over Pete. Don's past will come back to haunt him When? This is getting goooooood!

Hey,

I was watching Mad Men the other day, and I caught one of the montages, and ever since I've been searching like a mad man for it.

Can someone give me a link to where I can watch it, or the song that was played.

It aired early october, late september.

Thanks in advance

Interesting comments from posters wondering how the show can possibly incorporate additional cultural issues - especially dealing with the African American revolution of the 60's. Here's a thought: Sterling Cooper could hire a group of (college educated-qualified) African American ad men to target market their clients' products to African Americans. Novel idea, you guess? Guess again. Has anyone ever heard of how Pepsi revolutionized the ad world in the late 40's/early 50's by target marketing to African Americans?

Walter Mack, President of Pepsi-Cola in the 1940s, realized African Americans were an untapped market and the company's strategy of using advertising for a general audience either ignored African Americans or used ethnic stereotypes in portraying blacks. Pepsi stood to gain market share by targeting a portion of its advertising directly towards African Americans. Through his progressiveness, Mack hired Hennan Smith and Edward F. Boyd, two African American advertising executives, to lead a twelve man all-black ad team. They came up with an advertising campaign portraying black Americans in a positive light, featuring black families and influential African Americans. They also orchestrated a sales team composed entirely of African Americans around the country to promote Pepsi. Don't get me wrong, history proved that it wasn't all easy going for this team because of the discrimination of the time, but this type of nich marketing helped to cement Pepsi as one of the world's leading soft-drink companies and its market share as compared to Coke shot up dramatically during that time. After Mack left the company in 1950, support for the all-black ad team faded due to pressures from the industry.

Not to bore posters with this history lesson, but just a thought about a way the writers could intermingal African Americans into the show as it relates specifically to the "ad" world.

P.S. I enjoy the show and my post is not meant to champion a particlar cause - I just wanted to shed some light on what impact African Americans have had on the ad world, beyond being a part of the custodial staff.

Having now seen the "sneak peak" twice...

I really appreciated the way Betty allowed her daughter to stay up and watch the returns and even provided her with a question the ask her dad regarding the electorial college...not really indicative of the "mental midget" some posters accuse her of being..I thought that Don's response to this was that that was a question for adults not for a child to be answered... another indication that Don doesn't see his family a real people all the time only props to accompany his idealized life in the suburbs... and

....even though we all feel attracted to the romance, class and sexual intrigue that his budding romance with Rachael provides us...that will come tumbling down shortly...maybe as a result of the intersection between the knowledge of his early life provided to Rachael and that uncovered by Adam's death..things will be revealed that even the perfect Rachael with be unable to handle...

Nfromthe60s: thanks much for your information...I had actually attempted some research on this issue but could only find when the first Black ad agency was founded which was in 1969 so I assumed that the folk who founded it were employed at some majority agency prior to that time...

I do know that some industries did choose to integrate their work force from within meaning that many janitors and other service level empolyees worked their way up throught the rank..also many of these folks were college educated blacks who could not gain access to mainstream empolyment any other way. I worked for a bank during the 80s and their first black manager was a gentleman who was a porter when first hired...worked his way through college with a degree in business admin and worked his way thru the bank hirearchy (porter, night processing, clerk, teller, etc)...So if the writers choose to explore this avenue then I think it would be with a janitor...or maybe they'll find black ad man to work on clients for EBONY MAGAZINE one of the oldest Black publications in th country.

Also, the contemporary civil rights movement did not begin in the 60s but rather in the late 40s with the black servicemen returning from the war dissatisfied that they had "made the world safe for democrary" that they could not experience..first big civil rights action was the Montgomery bus boycott that gave us M.L King.

History lessons aside...I don't think that Rachael

I also wondered where the black characters' storylines were. In the second season (how wonderful to know there will be one!), I look forward to seeing these background characters move to the foreground.

There were too many good moments for this NOT to happen. From the scene early in the season, with the ladies' room attendants: "If those bags get any smaller, we'll starve"? I hoped for an episode about that woman's life. That was a terrific line.

Please add me to the rising chorus of Rachel fans. I'd love to see more of her. She's a quiet character, but magnetic, and the actress knows just how to pull this off. I can see Don being attracted to a woman who is watchful or a good listener. Rachel is both.

There are not enough still-water women on TV, if you ask me. I love this about Rachel. She's the standard-bearer for all of us ladies who know how to shut the hell up.

Finally, I loved Rachel's attempt to impose reason and moral standards on her late-night encounter with Don. There she was, all reason and standards ... in a midnight-blue negligee.

Yeah, Rachel! It was a swing and a miss, but at least you swung for the bleachers!

P.S. ... I think we'll see the return of Helen Bishop (divorcee neighbor) and her weird kid (Glen) pretty soon -- after all, Kennedy does win. She's the big Kennedy booster in the neighborhood. I think she'd seize her moment to rub that in ...

DivaDeeJee60s: I enjoyed your post. You didn't finish the last statement (or maybe it cut off):

"History lessons aside...I don't think that Rachael..."

Would love to hear the rest. I'm a big Rachel fan as well.

People of madmen Blog,

I am from the PC-Police and just wanted to say your doing great-- no violations have been written yet and thanks to the Women's Studies rhetoric and Diversity-Training bullet-points we have a clean board. back to work. Thanks

I was going to say that I don't think Rachael will continue her relationship with Don because she will tire of being "the other woman" no matter how much Don appears to love/care for her. I think guilt will get the best of her...it will affect her relationship with her sister which appears to be very close and I would hate to see the stuff hit the fan when/if her dad should find out....

I was also wondering who Rachael's escort is/was to the many social events she has got to attend in the other aspect of her life...she's got to bring someone the "family dinner"; what about Temple and civic events...I know she works a lot but during the 60's folks didn't generally work 80-100 hour weeks on a regular basis...even Peggy has a somewhat of a life outside of the office...So I'm wondering who was she dating before Don?

P.S.

...I think that Don will discover that is mom was not a whore in the classic sense just that she was a single woman who had an affair with a married man in the context of a small community and thus was referred to as a "whore"...I think that will change a bit of how he sees himself and conversely his relationship with Rachael; I think they will both find the relationship very confining since they are social equals they will not be able to go out in the manner that he went out with Midge...though they might travel to Eurpoe or somewhere else they will be unlikely to meet actualy or potential professional associates.

eric...thanks for your highly enlightened comment and all your hard work >

I love reading everyones comments and assumptions about the characters. Keep it up! I like rooting for Don but somethimes it's hard to because of his infidelity and his inability to share his feelings and past with his own wife. It's obvious that he's an all around "do what's right" kind of guy, but I still find myself saying "tisk tisk" everytime he bedhops.

Besides the show being entertaining, it's also like watching a history lesson!

With my laptop breaking down, I haven't been able to write anything, but here goes. Don't you folks find it ironic that MWeiner & Co. were tops in "Sopranos" a heavily male driven storyline, while "Madmen" really shows how "mad" we as humans can become. Particularly in a male driven realm as SC is. My guesses for future behavior of this great show, I'll have to do it another time. Love the blogs, I have never been as hooked on a show as this one!!!

I too am looking forward to the introduction of black storylines. Although given the way gender differences are dealt with on this show, I have to admit I’m a little apprehensive about how race and integration will be handled at Sterling Cooper. This fascinates me to no end because this would have been my parents’ generation as they entered and adjusted to life in corporate America. I’ve heard their war stories of what it was like to work “for the man” in the 1950s and 60s, and how they both opted out of that scene pretty damn quick, but it will be interesting to see how it all plays out in the world of the Mad Men.

By the way, there were black people working in advertising back then. The Vince Cullers agency (which still exists today) was started in the 1950s, but I believe there were black agencies at least as far back as the 1940s. At that time, there was at least one very prominent black marketing consultant--David J. Sullivan. He worked with a number of organizations to help them effectively reach black consumers, whose buying power in the late 40s and early 50s was estimated at $4.6 billion dollars. By 1960, I’m sure this number was much higher. There were plenty of media outlets that catered to black audiences, so it’s very likely there were agencies that provided advertising for those outlets as well. By 1960, black newspapers like the Chicago Defender, New York Amsterdam News, and the Los Angeles Sentinel had been in business at least 25 years, and still enjoyed wide circulation--even far beyond the city boundaries in which they operated. There were black radio stations where the advertising reflected the tastes, wants and desires of their audiences. And then there was the big dog: Johnson Publications, whose Jet and Ebony magazines were so successful by 1960, that Johnson often receives credit for creating the black consumer market. Both these magazines had been around for years, and were supported by advertising revenues. I’m sure that a few black companies were responsible for at least some of those ads?

Oh yeah, count me as a Rachel fan, too. Unfortunately, I don't see anything good coming from her relationship with Don--although I think he'll be the one who hurts most from it. I keep hearing her admonition to him when they had tea that day: "One thing about the Israeli's...don't cross them." That's definitely going to wind its way back into the story.

Yes, that Babylon episode has turned out to be probably the most pivotal episode in the series as it portrays several issues that are developed later on...that conversation tnat Don and Rachael have where we puts the serious make on her but where she also lets us know that though she is Jewish in nationality she is not necessarily Jewish in religious or cultural practice..We see Don being very intimate and romantic with Betty but then putting her on chill whenever he is even contemplating being near Rachael; we get the first flashback of Don's youth and family life...and we get to see that Peggy is more than a secretary not to mention the hot physical and emotional relationship between Joan and Roger but we also see Roger trying to figure out the disfuncitioality in his own family life..he is really at that point caught between two existences until his heart attack forces hin to choose his family..of course the fact that his wife is not really to be trifled with didn't hurt his choice of family first.

Grinandbearit: Vince Cullers just died last week (Oct 4th...ironically the date of last MM espisode)...he did found the first Black ad agency in 1956. His philosophy was: to approached corporate America with the idea that rather than integrating black people into a white concept of advertising, advertisers needed to buy into the idea of creating messages that resonated only with black people,” ...at that time the buying power among U.S. blacks was 4.5 billon dollars Among his clients were Kellog and the U.S. Treasury. The company was taken over by his son Jeff last year and reorganized as the Vince Cullers Group.

"His philosophy was: to approached corporate America with the idea that rather than integrating black people into a white concept of advertising, advertisers needed to buy into the idea of creating messages that resonated only with black people,”"

Oh-_ho_. Sounds like Cullers was one of the first to realize the power in demographics and pitching to specific audience segments--a practice that has spread from advertising into movies, TV, book publishing, and onto the net.

Has anyone noticed that the "Nixon vs. Kennedy" title will reflect not only the election face-off, but Don and Pete going at their own personal smackethdown as well? ;) Don's comment that he liked Nixon because he was a self-made man like himself is interesting in this regard.

Yes but while I loved that Kennedy won...I will be truly despondent if Pete bests Don in their personal battle...Someone suggested a while back that Pete might be a Kennedy mole...not sure if they were serious or joking..if Pete is not a mole..he is certainly a rat :)

Nixon - Kennedy

It goes back to the first or second episode when Cooper brings up working with the Nixon campaign. Don may prefer Nixon because he's a self-made man but Don's not an enthusiastic voter. I may have it wrong but as I recall, he said he didn't vote. He got onto the Nixon "bandwagon" because of S-C and tries to promote Nixon for reasons that sound good to him.

I doubt that Betty would care one way or the other except that Helen put her into a bind by first asking her to babysit her kid while she worked for the Kennedy campaign. Then virtually accusing her of leading the kid astray by giving him a lock of her hair. Hey, at any age I would have kept it in my "treasure box". Not asked for it or barged into the bathroom, but if given, would have kept it as being from the ideal woman.

But Betty is more the Republican demographic anyway than the Democratic.

Always thought that scene where Helen Hishop's kid barged into the bathroom while Betty was on the throne (The room didn't have a lock?) was the creepiest thing! He just stared at her! Then the little Ted-Bundy-in-training asked for a lock of her hair...and she gave it to him!! Creepy as hell!!!

I'm hooked on the show and the posts. I enjoy reading posters' theories about the characters, insightful references about history, and enlightning comments about their experiences related to this time period. What I've noticed most about this blog/comment board is that posters are using it as a forum to discuss the show's attributes on a "thinking" man's level. This is truly a credit to the producers and writers of Mad Men. Whoever thinks TV creates a class of mindless robots glued to the tube, has never seen Mad Men. Most intriguing to me is that the show seems to be permeating through a variety of demographic categories (i.e. ethnic, racial, socio-economic, gender, etc.). Thanks for putting on a show that allows us to use our brain. It's like attending an adult studies course on "Advertising: the 60's era".

...I think that Don will discover that is mom was not a whore in the classic sense just that she was a single woman who had an affair with a married man in the context of a small community and thus was referred to as a "whore"...I think that will change a bit of how he sees himself and conversely his relationship with Rachael;

DiveDeegee: Whoa.... very thought-provoking, and I think you're right.

Eric -- Of course this blogboard is clean -- These are smart, classy people watching/discussing this show. Not a bunch of low lifes.

Visan,

I'm with you on the Helen Bishop's kid thing. That weirded me out too. What a creepy little bastard he was. What the hell was that whole scene about?

I never understood the significance of the lock of hair. Does this mean something that I'm not clued in on? I do remember a poem by somebody called "The Rape of a Lock" by Keats or Shelly or one of those Romance Period Poets but I didn't commit it to memory like I do poker hands. I never understood why Helen was mad at Betty for giving it to the little perv it's not like she striped for him. (Not that I would have minded watching that.)

I don't think Betty thought twice about his request. Some weird kid wants some of your hair, you've got plenty, OK here it is. No big deal. Is there more to this than I'm aware of?

Dennis, It's actually Alexander Pope, who came before the romantics. Interesting that you should bring that up though. The context of the poem and "rape" was very sexual, which makes sense here. I can't provide much in terms of how it relates to a boy asking for a lock of hair other than the fact that I think it was mostly the boy experiencing a first crush for a very pretty woman. If you're interested, here's the full text of the poem:

http://poetry.eserver.org/rape-of-the-lock.html.

On another note, I agree with other posters about Don/Rachel and how it will not turn out well. I also agree that she will do the dumping but that they will continue somehow to circle around each other and make other attempts at a relationship to no avail.

RE: Don being a "whore child"

I too thought this was strange that if his mother was a "whore" in the true sense of the word (for a living) she would have no idea who Don's father was, and if she dropped him on the door of one of her "Johns," he would protest the same. Makes much more sense that they were having an affair, and his father knew full well that Don was his child. The stepmother just keeps calling him that to reinforce the father's guilt.

And I don't know where some of the posters are getting the idea that Don and Rachel are siblings or half-siblings. They definitely don't have the same father (Don's alcoholic farmer-father), and Rachel's mother's 2 children are from her husband, the respectible Mr. Menkin. They didn't even grow up in the same area. NY vs. Rural wherever.

Can't wait until tomorrow!

Interesting I've never read where anyone suggested that Don and Rachel were half siblings...that is just too Jerry Springer and soap opera-ish....

That is a complete stretch that Don and Rachel are related. Just because they both have dark hair and eyes? WTF?

Regarding the kid-and-the-lock-of-hair thing: it finally made sense to me when Betty revealed that she used to be a model. I think the reason she didn't hesitate to comply with the kid's request was that she couldn't resist the notion that someone considered her a superstar. Finally, after all this time in obscurity, she has a fan who wants a keepsake. Her dream come true. I think Helen recognized Betty's blatant narcissism and was outraged, hence the slap in the grocery store.

As for Don's secret past--could it be that his mother was black, or part black? In the early '60s that would doom his career and his chance to marry a Grace Kelly lookalike--and probably his relationship with Rachel, too.

OK Visan,

I was all ready to propose marriage to you, and was headed out the door to my lawyer's office to have the prenup drawn up, when you hit me with the best line of the blog: "Then the little Ted Bundy in training"

I'm super competitive and I know in my heart that I can't beat that. Just as the little weasel Pete would do I'm going into my office to sulk and have a drink. I think I'll yell at my secretary too just to recreate the complete effect. Visan, that was really good!!!

Well, Dennis....That's the nicest thing I've heard all day!

I have asked people around me @ work & other places & NO ONE seems to be watching this show!!!So I am very happy to see all the interest on the blogs. I believe Don & Rachel are really in love, I watched the last episode again last night and could seem much more heat & depth with them. I like to record & then re-watch during the week, esp., after reading alot of your posts.

Peggy, to me has always seemed very disconnected w/ her feelings. When she saw the gyn., it was all so clinical in her choosing BC. She didn't seem to be concerned about being a "bad girl" which I think would have been an issue in that era....Also, Joan gave an aside in the bird cage episode where she said, "I hate hospitals" and it stuck w/ me, I knew it was going to come up, & there it was w/ Roger! Again that scene where her roommate confesses her love was directly from the movie, and was just as heartbreaking. Joan is a clever woman, & wasn't about to alienate her friend, so she behaved in her unemotional blow off.............

Roger-That was the best he could come up with as a compliment, & I am sorry to tell you in '88 I had a boss who told me on his last day, that I had the greatest a** he'd ever seen (no I wasn't "doing" him!), so somethings don't change : (. Maybe it was a farewell, but Joan finally got "it" on her standing.

I wb very interested in what happens to Betty, & how she changes. I expect a massive change & I can't see her doing anything else but divorce Don once she "really" finds out. I don't think he will be upfront about it, I think it wb a really blatant mistake or error that reveals the affair.

Pete used to annoy me & still does, but in a different way. I don't think he'll ever be happy. I liked what someone wrote about being the office Pee Wee Herman.Except that PW was fun!!! The actor that plays him is great!!!

Don's voice does it for me!! His looks are icing on the cake. He's not a "man-ho", he's an emotional mess! This show is about flawed characters, like we all are, so enjoy the fiction that it is!!!

Zebra,

I can't agree with Rachel dumping Don. I certainly don't agree with Don dumping Rachel.

As long as Don's delivering "Da Meat" she's going nowhere. Actually, where exactly does she have to go, back upstairs to spend quality time with the dogs? This guy is the bomb and she knows it. He loves her and she knows it. He bangs her brains out and that she definitely knows that and appreciates it. I've got some experience with Career Chicks and this deal is perfect for her. She gets to run her company and get great sex from a great looking guy. I read a biography of Coco Channel while waiting in my Doctor’s office one day and Rachel seems to be of the same mold. I don't see Rachel changing diapers and neither does she. Getting screwed by Don until she can’t walk straight. Yea, I can see that.

Don’s not going anywhere either. Betty’s a good front woman for him. Betty might leave Don but Don’s not leaving Betty. What would be the point. Rachel takes care of the emotional and sexual business and Betty takes care of the home front mommy business. This guy’s a clever dude even if Betty picks up a boyfriend the deal works for the both of them. He ain’t pushing it. Nothing wrong with having a super hot and horny blond plan B. This affair could last years maybe decades.

Zebra,

I can't agree with Rachel dumping Don. I certainly don't agree with Don dumping Rachel.

As long as Don's delivering "Da Meat" she's going nowhere. Actually, where exactly does she have to go, back upstairs to spend quality time with the dogs? This guy is the bomb and she knows it. He loves her and she knows it. He bangs her brains out and that she definitely knows that and appreciates it. I've got some experience with Career Chicks and this deal is perfect for her. She gets to run her company and get great sex from a great looking guy. I read a biography of Coco Channel while waiting in my Doctor’s office one day and Rachel seems to be of the same mold. I don't see Rachel changing diapers and neither does she. Getting screwed by Don until she can’t walk straight. Yea, I can see that.

Don’s not going anywhere either. Betty’s a good front woman for him. Betty might leave Don but Don’s not leaving Betty. What would be the point. Rachel takes care of the emotional and sexual business and Betty takes care of the home front mommy business. This guy’s a clever dude even if Betty picks up a boyfriend the deal works for the both of them. He ain’t pushing it. Nothing wrong with having a super hot and horny blond plan B. This affair could last years maybe decades.

I hear you, Dennis, but Rachel's not going to succumb to f**kbuddy status like Midge did. I think she'll make him work harder for her (so to speak).

I could go on for years (and many do) so it gives the writers lots of leeway to develop the drama as Rachel and Don get closer.

AUTHOR: 'Sereno scribbler
EMAIL: tuh1015@earthlink.net
IP: 204.108.79.221
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DATE: 10/10/2007 05:55:45 PM

“I still feel Don and Rachel's sexual scenes are awkward”

Perhaps that’s because their whole situation is awkward. Despite their very deep emotional connection, physically—-in the outside world-—there’s a chasm between them. He’s married; she’s his client. They’re tiptoeing around each other, trying to figure out how to make it work. That’s awkward.

Don wants and needs Rachel, but the only way he can fit her into the tidy, compartmentalized life he’s built for himself, is to take something out-—to break down the partitions, and remove the compartments. Like Menken’s Department Store, he needs a major redesign--to “throw out the baby with the bath water,” as Daddy Menken called it—-so he can move forward. Rachel’s planned remodel symbolizes the journey that Don must make himself. She is the catalyst that will ultimately change everything-—Menken’s, Don Draper, society (along with women’s place in it), and thus the world.

In the process, Rachel will be faced with her own dilemma: she’ll have to choose between Don and the department store. The place that served as the springboard for their relationship will also bring it to a screeching halt. Rachel has devoted a lifetime to making the store what she “always thought it should be.” Too bad that the man she hired to realize her dream, will also be the one who detracts her from it.

We’re uncomfortable because they’re uncomfortable. We know that nothing good will come of this relationship, as do they, despite moving full on into it. Both characters understand the challenges they face, which makes them cautious, scared, nervous--awkward.